Did DA know what he was doing? (I told you so)

[Voice of Reason]

Which just goes to show how fickle and hard to please football supporters are.

Adams was far from perfect, i didn't like everything he did, but during his 1400 days in charge (give or take) we had a visit to Wembley, a promotion, 2 fantastic games against Liverpool, now if you cast your minds back, can you prompt me to any such highs during the 1400 days prior to his arrival?

There was nothing flat about beating Pompey in the last minute of Extra time, there was nothing flat about our charge up league 1 the season before.

I think we all accept that DA wasn't everyones cup of tea, but those wanting to re-write history, are the ones dumbing down some fantastic moments in supporting Argyle. Anyone who didn't enjoy the two Liverpool games (yes we bored them to tears at Anfield, but it was a great performance), Hartley's heroics and Argyle fans discussing how much they would win for a top 6 finish having been bottom at Christmas - are the ones with a limited memory.

The 4 years before DA's arrive were some of the bleakest in my times of supporting the Greens, sadly this season has taken a gloss off his tenure, the moment any manager loses a changing room he has to go - no one is happy about how the season finished.

He will find work again, because he has a hunger, a desire and determination - that will undoubtedly impress a Chairman at some point. He will look back at his time with us and no doubt (inwardly at least) try to learn from his mistakes, he is unlikely to admit them, as his persona is one of being in total control (again a reason many didn't warm to him, but to others it may be seen as a strength) - both parties need a new chapter, but it would be wrong to think he whole tenure was one of disappointment.

 

[xmastree]

His position became untenable in the end but I still feel he is a decent manager at this level and would be a good appointment for somebody else.

Ultimately people wanted his team's playing a different brand of football, not that they complained when it won us promotion. When we played that style and didn't win it became a problem.

It'll be interesting to see if our next manager can match his achievements.

This whitewashing of the past is a bit misleading.

Plenty of people didn't enjoy the Adams brand of football throughout his entire tenure, and there's been loads of comments about how it was the flattest promotion season imaginable. To now pretend "no-one complained at the time" is just incorrect.


Obviously he'll get another job, but I think potential employers will look at the amount of pointless, wasteful signings he made at us and ask questions about his judgement and use of a budget. I suspect he'll end up back in Scotland.

Obviously lots of people enjoyed the style of play as the crowds increased. Perhaps the extra 4,000+ didn’t really understand football?

Extra 4000 +? How do you arrive at that?

Having looked at seasonal average home gates (courtesy of GOS), I can't find 4000+. The figures for the last 8 seasons are as follows:

Pre- Adams

2011-12 6915
2012-13 7069
2013-14 7304
2014-15 7693

The Adams era

2015-16 9054
2016-17 9652
2017-18 10413
2018-19 9851

2011-12 was the lowest seasonal average since 2000-01 (pre Sturrock). From there gates rose steadily reaching 7693 in Sheridan's last season. There was a big jump in Adams's first season, and then continued growth over his next two. I accept that 2018-19 was down at least partly due to the Grandstand closure.

So Adams's best supported season (10413) averaged 2720 more than Sheridan's final year.

I'm am 100% sure that you will spin the figures to back your argument, and am fascinated to see how you do it.

 

[JannerinCardiff]

Nearly 3 years ago, in July 2016, during the close season after the 1st year of Adams' management, I started a thread entitled "Does DA know what he's doing?". My reluctant conclusion was that in my view, he didn't know what he was doing.
I got fairly well lambasted for my view, and we did get promoted in 2017, contrary to my expectations: so, fair play, it appeared that my view was incorrect.
However, here we are 3 years later, after 4 years of DA's management, right back where we started (that is, in purely footballing terms), and increasing numbers of contributors seem to now share my opinion.
Was my original view therefore an incorrect one?

Personally I think Derek Adams is a very good manager, just in the same way Mourinho is. You may not like his style of football or how he comes across as a person with the fans but he is a good manager, his CV backs that up.

 

[David Friio's mate]

His position became untenable in the end but I still feel he is a decent manager at this level and would be a good appointment for somebody else.

Ultimately people wanted his team's playing a different brand of football, not that they complained when it won us promotion. When we played that style and didn't win it became a problem.

It'll be interesting to see if our next manager can match his achievements.

This whitewashing of the past is a bit misleading.

Plenty of people didn't enjoy the Adams brand of football throughout his entire tenure, and there's been loads of comments about how it was the flattest promotion season imaginable. To now pretend "no-one complained at the time" is just incorrect.


Obviously he'll get another job, but I think potential employers will look at the amount of pointless, wasteful signings he made at us and ask questions about his judgement and use of a budget. I suspect he'll end up back in Scotland.

Obviously lots of people enjoyed the style of play as the crowds increased. Perhaps the extra 4,000+ didn’t really understand football?

Did I say everyone was unhappy? Or did I say that there were people didn't like his brand of football and to pretend otherwise was wrong?

You really need to find a way to let go of this Adams worship reverie you bizarrely still seem to be stuck in, he quite rightly got the sack, move on with your life. You'll love again, it'll be OK!

 

[Voice of Reason]

As some people go to any lengths to try and prove DA was a complete failure from day 1.

As always the truth lay somewhere in-between, but he did in his first three seasons bring a degree of success, that the years 2011-15 suggested was far from a formality.

 

[the corkscrew]

Different levels but when you see Pochetino's rapport with the players, it shows you've got to take the players with you

Adams ended up alienating everyone & I dare say that had a big part to play in the odd performances from the team

 

[David Friio's mate]

As some people go to any lengths to try and prove DA was a complete failure from day 1.

As always the truth lay somewhere in-between, but he did in his first three seasons bring a degree of success, that the years 2011-15 suggested was far from a formality.

100%.

It's been a funny few years. Successes and failures seemed to both come with asterisks.

 

[PL2 3DQ]

As some people go to any lengths to try and prove DA was a complete failure from day 1.

As always the truth lay somewhere in-between, but he did in his first three seasons bring a degree of success, that the years 2011-15 suggested was far from a formality.

It does seem that Adams does really well for three seasons and then struggles in his fourth season.
At the time he was the ninth longest serving manager in the top four leagues so there will be many chairmen happy to have him for three seasons of success, which in terms of the life expectancy of a football manager is a long time.

The irony is that if Adams had achieved the same success at another club as he did at Argyle he would be the perfect manager we are looking for now and would be one of the favourites for the Argyle job!

 

[r4h4al]

In all seriousness maybe he was a bad manager all along who carried the momentum left with John Sheridan taking us to a play-off spot, perhaps Sheridan should take more credit for the promotion than Adams.
Then perhaps he did fluke the run last year, and it was down to the momentum rather than down to Adams' ability as a manager.
Then this season speaks for itself. A little purple patch where really Ruben just decided to turn up which won us a few games, and the rest of the season a disaster,

For Adams now I just hope he takes a deserved break, but I don't think he has a future in English football anymore. Sad times.

He really was a mess when it came to recruitment. We changed too much last season and we went into this season with a weaker defence than the one that took us to 5th in League Two in 2015/16 (Sawyer/Hartley/Nelson/Mellor).

I was thinking about his and don't know why certain people keep referring to a "complete overhaul" in the summer. Of the 1st choice players we lost Bradley and Threlkeld plus the loaness of Vyner and Matthews (which don't count).
I don't understand why certain people say Luke should've stayed either? He was dropped in last season for Matthews and then moved for 1st team football.
Macey was signed because on paper it sounds like a coup, he probably didn't live up to Adam's expectation but in the end has done all right. Not a good but not a bad signing.
Canavan effectively replaced Bradley and although a good player, what we missed was the leadership that Bradley brought. So a poor signing :sad:
Riley effectively came in to replace Threlkeld which was a poor signing, and Moore was even worse.
I think the signings being poor is more the budget than Adams. He can't be expected to keep signing good players for nothing and he seemed to make some good signings in his first 2 seasons. But unfortunately the signings this season weren't good enough and Adams has just bizarrely been a bad manager this season which lends me to think he was a bad manager all along.
Very much looking forward to an improved manager and with him doing much better in L1 when we get there hopefully straight away.

 

[GreenThing]

Adams has his faults and should have done better last season, but to suggest he fluked the previous 3 years? Really?

 

[Bristol Rich]

His position became untenable in the end but I still feel he is a decent manager at this level and would be a good appointment for somebody else.

Ultimately people wanted his team's playing a different brand of football, not that they complained when it won us promotion. When we played that style and didn't win it became a problem.

It'll be interesting to see if our next manager can match his achievements.

This whitewashing of the past is a bit misleading.

Plenty of people didn't enjoy the Adams brand of football throughout his entire tenure, and there's been loads of comments about how it was the flattest promotion season imaginable. To now pretend "no-one complained at the time" is just incorrect.


Obviously he'll get another job, but I think potential employers will look at the amount of pointless, wasteful signings he made at us and ask questions about his judgement and use of a budget. I suspect he'll end up back in Scotland.

Obviously lots of people enjoyed the style of play as the crowds increased. Perhaps the extra 4,000+ didn’t really understand football?

Extra 4000+ is that what the vicar told you in the Church of Derek Adams last Sunday?

Have you got to the story yet where he walks across the Tamer?

 

[Kentishgreen]

Clearly not as he was only around for a short time.

 

[Balham Green]

His position became untenable in the end but I still feel he is a decent manager at this level and would be a good appointment for somebody else.

Ultimately people wanted his team's playing a different brand of football, not that they complained when it won us promotion. When we played that style and didn't win it became a problem.

It'll be interesting to see if our next manager can match his achievements.

This whitewashing of the past is a bit misleading.

Plenty of people didn't enjoy the Adams brand of football throughout his entire tenure, and there's been loads of comments about how it was the flattest promotion season imaginable. To now pretend "no-one complained at the time" is just incorrect.


Obviously he'll get another job, but I think potential employers will look at the amount of pointless, wasteful signings he made at us and ask questions about his judgement and use of a budget. I suspect he'll end up back in Scotland.

Obviously lots of people enjoyed the style of play as the crowds increased. Perhaps the extra 4,000+ didn’t really understand football?

Extra 4000+ is that what the vicar told you in the Church of Derek Adams last Sunday?

Have you got to the story yet where he walks across the Tamer?

I was never an Adams fan but there were times when we did play exciting footie AT HOME with Ruben and Carey on song. Away from home we were usually shocking though.

 

[rsp4]

Adams has his faults and should have done better last season, but to suggest he fluked the previous 3 years? Really?

I don't think he fluked promotion or the play offs. The play offs was partly helped by Sheridan who achieved similar the previous season and Hartley's celebration against Pompey will live long in the memory.

The promotion season he got right but for me personally it was just so meh and I have never said that about any success.

I do think he fluked the run last year and the outcome of this season was a true reflection of both seasons in lg1.

 

[edengreen]

Personally thought he tried to play football in the first season
When it didn't win promotion he went for beasts in the team long ball and defend hard
Jarvis was great along with Wylde and Kennedy

However this last season he signed nothing near the quality we had in the first two years for whatever reason
I think we had a better team in the first two years than this season
This season's team wouldn't have got into the league 2 play offs making the decision to offer so many new contracts bizarre at best