Manager Poll

[Marcus The Green]

I can take a defeat but last night was an accumulation of poor decisions and poor performances that tipped me over the edge and wanting a change.
Two incidents late in the Burton game led me to believe that Fletcher isn't good enough.

1: Lennox was sent on a late sub to replace Lowry with Gurrieri moving into the middle from the left, Lennox ran over to the right wing position, in the exact same position as Cowan-Hall. Both players looked at each other, asking "what are you doing here?" and yet Lennox and Cowan-Hall both stayed in the right wing position within five yards of each other for the next five minutes leaving a gaping hope on the left side of midfield.
With just two minutes of injury time left the players sorted it out and Lennox moved over to the left.
Did the coaching staff give Lennox instructions to double up with Cowan-Hall on the right leaving Bhasera exposed on the left? Was it a cunning plan? If it was a mistake or Cowan-Hall refused to move why didn't Fletcher spot it and sort it out?

2: It's already been mentioned but the body language of Fletcher in the last 10 minutes was the one of a defeated man. In fact, he gave up and sat down and when Nelson had a chance to pump the ball forward to Griffiths but instead chose to pass to Blanchard Fletcher held his head in his hands. There was no leadership or inspiration given to the team (or fans) for those last 10 minutes.

For many fans it's difficult to call for Fletcher to be removed from his job because he stood shoulder-to-shoulder with us during 2011 and led the players and staff, either as captain or manager, through some dark days.
He gave up his playing career to concentrate on managing our team so we have the sensitive issue of Fletcher struggling to find a playing job let alone a job as a manager should he be sacked from Home Park.

Perhaps a short-term compromise would be for Fletcher to swallow his pride and accept help from a more experienced coach because as it stands the situation cannot continue. Can we even afford another coach? Can we even afford to sack Fletcher and employ a new manager?

We deserve better.

Good post. The bit at the top sums up how I feel. The lack of a tactical back up plan & lack of leadership from the sidelines is a bad thing at any level of football.

The embolden bit at the bottom. When Fletcher had Deehan as a mentor, we won games on a semi regular basis with what could be argued as a weaker team, Deehan leaves.....we don't win as many games & struggle to change them. It might just be coincidence?

If we do end up getting rid of Fletcher, the replacement will be someone who is currently out of work & without the pedigree that us fans would wish for. The replacement will be cheap but experienced if Brent has learnt from giving Fletcher his chance.

I can't see Brent getting rid or Fletcher walking. Again, it is a case of us fans asking "how much more?" whilst the attendances fall.

 

[ejh]

Got to give him to at least the end of the season, last season was a great opportunity which was missed when Fletch picked you up well after the debacle of the Scouse knobber on 10 grand a week, now with Barnet coming to hand there must be a better than even chance of the mighty Argyle slipping out through the trap door.

The argument is made that we are still in a higher league position than when Tisdale came on board, that applies for you as well so the problem would appear to be in the perception. Tisdale has had six years, Fletch has had one and a bit, Tisdale has had Perryman and some experienced coaches to lean on, Fletch has had none of that as well as dealing with an even more constrained budget. Watching cack week in and week out is harsh, that's a given, plus there is always the chance of a bounce from any new manager coming in, iirc there was a distinct Fletch bounce, albeit a short one, as always fans should be careful what they wish for.

Your average fans perspective rarely stretches beyond the next 45 minutes, Brent's will probably be nothing short of six years, he will be making big money from the development but there are no positives in the team doing badly and let's not forget that every side in the mix down there will have "football people" involved.

Still, while it lasts there is one upside, last night's result certainly cheered me up no end.

Happy days.

The only thing with this is Fletch probably doubled the budget with his signings - has Tisdale ever had that luxury? Has Tisdale ever been given a budget based on, allegedly (delete as you see appropriate mods), 7,500 attendances?

The answer is probably no, when Tisdale arrived Exeter were a tinpot club, and when he got them promoted they were still a tinppot club. They've never had 50 grand to scratch their arse with. The situations are hardly comparable, and one place above the relegation zone is not a benchmark this club should ever get used to.

 

[briangreen]

Immediate.
A cancer has to be cut away before it spreads and further and gets worse.

so when you leaving :greensmile:

 

[bandwagon]

I'm a thumbs down for Fletch but I honestly think Brent will keep him on - as he always said, he was a 'reluctant buyer' so why worry about the football, he's off the hook!! Time will tell as always - let me know when it's over, I was so looking forward to getting behind the club this season!!

 

[briangreen]

Got to give him to at least the end of the season, last season was a great opportunity which was missed when Fletch picked you up well after the debacle of the Scouse knobber on 10 grand a week, now with Barnet coming to hand there must be a better than even chance of the mighty Argyle slipping out through the trap door.

The argument is made that we are still in a higher league position than when Tisdale came on board, that applies for you as well so the problem would appear to be in the perception. Tisdale has had six years, Fletch has had one and a bit, Tisdale has had Perryman and some experienced coaches to lean on, Fletch has had none of that as well as dealing with an even more constrained budget. Watching cack week in and week out is harsh, that's a given, plus there is always the chance of a bounce from any new manager coming in, iirc there was a distinct Fletch bounce, albeit a short one, as always fans should be careful what they wish for.

Your average fans perspective rarely stretches beyond the next 45 minutes, Brent's will probably be nothing short of six years, he will be making big money from the development but there are no positives in the team doing badly and let's not forget that every side in the mix down there will have "football people" involved.

Still, while it lasts there is one upside, last night's result certainly cheered me up no end.

Happy days.

The only thing with this is Fletch probably doubled the budget with his signings - has Tisdale ever had that luxury? Has Tisdale ever been given a budget based on, allegedly (delete as you see appropriate mods), 7,500 attendances?

The answer is probably no, when Tisdale arrived Exeter were a tinpot club, and when he got them promoted they were still a tinppot club. They've never had 50 grand to scratch their arse with. The situations are hardly comparable, and one place above the relegation zone is not a benchmark this club should ever get used to.

Never thought the day would come when a city fan would be more passionate about Argyle than an Argyle fan, says it all really...

You totally missed his point, Tisdale has had 6 years and not all those have been tickety-boo (relegations included), Fletcher has had just over a year (no relegations as yet, mind you if we had kept our 'experienced' manager be sure we would be playing in the Blue square this year)).
I don't want to see Tisdale, Hodges, Megson, Lee or any of the others mentioned on this site. Long live Carl Fletcher, just give him a transfer fund.

 

[Argyle sy]

I'm a thumbs down for Fletch but I honestly think Brent will keep him on - as he always said, he was a 'reluctant buyer' so why worry about the football, he's off the hook!! Time will tell as always - let me know when it's over, I was so looking forward to getting behind the club this season!!

Surely though, as a successful businessman James Brent should be looking at last nights crowd, at the performances on pitch, and the amount of disatisfaction amongst the fanbase and realise that this cannot continue, if it wasn't for Gills being expected to bring a large travelling support on Saturday then we could easily of been looking at a sub 5,000 crowd.Surely, as a succesful businessman he can't just expect to allow things to continue and alienate a last percentage of the fanbase without repercusions(dwindling fan base not prepared to accept the mediocrity currently on offer at home park). The other way I look at it, what is the point of having a bright, shiny new grandstand if it only going to be 20% full ?. Whilst I agree that we need a new grandstand, training facilities etc we can't take our eye off of the lifeblood of the club which is the team. Without there being a better standard of product on the pitch the crowds are going to fall and the nice, new, shiny grandstand will just be a white elephant.

 

[Ave IT]

now with Barnet coming to hand there must be a better than even chance of the mighty Argyle slipping out through the trap door.

Care for a wager on that? Tell you what I’ll give you evens on it. No – I didn’t think you would.

Your lot won the other night didn’t they ? No wonder you’re so chipper - after all it was nine games since you last managed it and if you had lost again and we’d held on to our lead you’d now be below us in the league. Hardly pulling up trees are you? Presumably, you’d then be talking kak about City “falling thru’ the trapdoor” – then again you wouldn’t be posting here then would you?. Careful what you wish for you said – that applies to you LT as much as us because if Fletch does get the push there’s a certain cravat-wearing manager who might welcome the chance to do something with a bigger club that despite everything STILL gets near double the crowds and he certainly sounded p’eed off recently with the few “ignorant” fans that do show up.

 

[ejh]

I can take a defeat but last night was an accumulation of poor decisions and poor performances that tipped me over the edge and wanting a change.
Two incidents late in the Burton game led me to believe that Fletcher isn't good enough.

1: Lennox was sent on a late sub to replace Lowry with Gurrieri moving into the middle from the left, Lennox ran over to the right wing position, in the exact same position as Cowan-Hall. Both players looked at each other, asking "what are you doing here?" and yet Lennox and Cowan-Hall both stayed in the right wing position within five yards of each other for the next five minutes leaving a gaping hope on the left side of midfield.
With just two minutes of injury time left the players sorted it out and Lennox moved over to the left.
Did the coaching staff give Lennox instructions to double up with Cowan-Hall on the right leaving Bhasera exposed on the left? Was it a cunning plan? If it was a mistake or Cowan-Hall refused to move why didn't Fletcher spot it and sort it out?

2: It's already been mentioned but the body language of Fletcher in the last 10 minutes was the one of a defeated man. In fact, he gave up and sat down and when Nelson had a chance to pump the ball forward to Griffiths but instead chose to pass to Blanchard Fletcher held his head in his hands. There was no leadership or inspiration given to the team (or fans) for those last 10 minutes.

For many fans it's difficult to call for Fletcher to be removed from his job because he stood shoulder-to-shoulder with us during 2011 and led the players and staff, either as captain or manager, through some dark days.
He gave up his playing career to concentrate on managing our team so we have the sensitive issue of Fletcher struggling to find a playing job let alone a job as a manager should he be sacked from Home Park.

Perhaps a short-term compromise would be for Fletcher to swallow his pride and accept help from a more experienced coach because as it stands the situation cannot continue. Can we even afford another coach? Can we even afford to sack Fletcher and employ a new manager?

We deserve better.

Although I'm an exile, this post sums up my views too. I even supported Fletch after Dorchester but the hole keeps getting bigger and bigger. The issue which worries me most is what you've alluded to. Fletch was our most charismatic, influential inspirational player. Remember him giving Stockdale and absolute b#ll*cking in front of the Devonport after Bristol City game? He was a total leader on the pitch and demanded professionalism and 100% from everyone.

Now he's gaffer he's totally withdrawn. He seems broken and defeated. When we concede soft goals and cruel counterattacks he doesn't flinch. This isn't the Fletch we knew and appointed. The Fletch we knew was a god to the players, got 100% out of the players last season. Now after a good spell of play, the players take a knock and then roll over and die. Where has Fletcher's grip on the team mentality gone? Tactically, it's hard for me to criticise without being at the games but there is overwhelming criticism of his decisions on the postmatch threads. When you go 2-1 down with ten mins to go, you shouldn't need 5 mins to make a decision. Last season his changes were usually bringing energy in Young on, or strength in Big Steve, and the team knew the drill when these players came on. This season the subs have been baffling and too complicated, too much shuffling - your point about Lennox and PCH being on the same wing being a case in point.

Last night was the last straw for me - the club needs a change.

It's clear from the redundancies there is £0 budget to play with. So the compromise needs to be Fletch, Larrieu and Nancekivell tearing up their contracts and what's owed for a change to even be feasible. Is that appropriate given how long they worked for no pay, probably not. Unless Brent can negotiate some sort of staggered settlement of payments.

The other option is Fletch getting fit again and going into the playing squad, and also working as a coach under a new manager. A bitter pill to swallow for Carl, but he's not ready for management yet and this would allow him to concentrate on two more years of his career. As well as bolstering our midfield immeasurably.

 

[ejh]

Got to give him to at least the end of the season, last season was a great opportunity which was missed when Fletch picked you up well after the debacle of the Scouse knobber on 10 grand a week, now with Barnet coming to hand there must be a better than even chance of the mighty Argyle slipping out through the trap door.

The argument is made that we are still in a higher league position than when Tisdale came on board, that applies for you as well so the problem would appear to be in the perception. Tisdale has had six years, Fletch has had one and a bit, Tisdale has had Perryman and some experienced coaches to lean on, Fletch has had none of that as well as dealing with an even more constrained budget. Watching cack week in and week out is harsh, that's a given, plus there is always the chance of a bounce from any new manager coming in, iirc there was a distinct Fletch bounce, albeit a short one, as always fans should be careful what they wish for.

Your average fans perspective rarely stretches beyond the next 45 minutes, Brent's will probably be nothing short of six years, he will be making big money from the development but there are no positives in the team doing badly and let's not forget that every side in the mix down there will have "football people" involved.

Still, while it lasts there is one upside, last night's result certainly cheered me up no end.

Happy days.

The only thing with this is Fletch probably doubled the budget with his signings - has Tisdale ever had that luxury? Has Tisdale ever been given a budget based on, allegedly (delete as you see appropriate mods), 7,500 attendances?

The answer is probably no, when Tisdale arrived Exeter were a tinpot club, and when he got them promoted they were still a tinppot club. They've never had 50 grand to scratch their arse with. The situations are hardly comparable, and one place above the relegation zone is not a benchmark this club should ever get used to.

Never thought the day would come when a city fan would be more passionate about Argyle than an Argyle fan, says it all really...

You totally missed his point, Tisdale has had 6 years and not all those have been tickety-boo (relegations included), Fletcher has had just over a year (no relegations as yet, mind you if we had kept our 'experienced' manager be sure we would be playing in the Blue square this year)).
I don't want to see Tisdale, Hodges, Megson, Lee or any of the others mentioned on this site. Long live Carl Fletcher, just give him a transfer fund.

You're right, I have missed his point. So we need to be loyal to managers, give them time and be marginally above where we were 6 years ago when we hired him? Be loyal to managers when the results are disastrous, such as when we sacked Reid who you state would have taken us to the Conference? Is Fletch not doing that now? Please help me understand the point I'm not seeing.

 

[X Isle]

Good in patches ain't good enough.

One year on from Stourbridge and we've not improved. And that's with a large squad for this level too.

Acting now will give the new manager a period to assess the squad before the window re-opens. Waiting for Christmas just leaves the new manager no time for assessments and delays the point at which improvements can start taking effect.........and as for waiting for the season to end?, that could be suicidal.

Time is up.

 

[Tony Flags]

I agree with Mr X Isle. Christmas sacking means the new manager will not get the chance to exploit the January window.

It is case of when now and not if with a football head on.

The only reason Fletch is still in a job this afternoon is the relationship with the powers that be.

It's all a bit sad and painful. Just get it over with.

 

[philking12]

Taxi for fletch& co.

 

[Ghost]

Time to go Fletch.

 

[subbuteo]

Mmmmm 250ish votes so far. Hardly representative of the whole argyle community.

A heavy loss on Saturday could be a rubicon moment.

Perhaps then, the more ribald posters will revel in the gory extirpation of Mr Fletcher in their ever inimical fashion.

 

[Clem]

I dont see the point in sacking Fletch. Im sure he is working his socks off for the club but without success. It would also cost money. I think the best way to go would be to appoint an experienced manager , there are always plenty available who would take the job, and demote Fletch to coach until the end of the season. Fletch has previouly ask for help and Im sure he would be relieved to have the pressure taken off him, his future could be decided then as well as the other coaches. Keeping things as they are is not an option in my view , good luck to him whatever happens.