The price of relegation

[JannerinCardiff]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

Spot on Oddball..

 

[Metal Green Mickey]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

It’s looking more likely every time we play another league game.

Keeping Adams on is the right thing because l think the other option would see Wotton in charge and it would get worse.

His pragmatic football can scrap us out of this. However, the likelihood is that we are good bet to go down (even at this stage of the season) because we have too many areas of the team that need addressing. Defence, midfield and attack. I mean, where do you start?

I haven’t seen a side so totally disorganised like this for some time. I even think the league one that got relegated and were dismal as we were about to enter administration, would of beaten this team. That’s how poor they are.

Unless you believe in miracles I’m afraid the season is going to one of the worst we have had to endure as Argyle fans.

 

[JannerinCardiff]

Cost is pure conjecture unfortunately

The cost of keeping Adams is longer term pain

You forget that any decent incoming replacement manager might demand a golden hello, larger salary and assisted relocation expenses. So any attempt to identify the cost of a change of manager is purely guess work all round.

Or there might be none of these costs and a replacement might have less of a salary .. it’s pure speculation.

 

[Bermudian Green]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

I thought that the grandstand redevelopment was being paid for via a very long term loan from Simon Hallett, as opposed to being paid for by gate receipts, and as such relegation would have little impact on paying off that loan?

 

[crownhill pilgrim]

The costs ate multiple, especially the loss of upward, season-on-season progress, the continued status of 'Same old Argyle' to the wider Plymouth public and the fact that League 2 is not an easy league to get out of.

 

[Biggs]

The costs ate multiple, especially the loss of upward, season-on-season progress, the continued status of 'Same old Argyle' to the wider Plymouth public and the fact that League 2 is not an easy league to get out of.

Eh? But anyone could have got us promoted. And you’d have to be a complete and utter no-hoper to only finish second and blow the title.

 

[philmeboots]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

I thought that the grandstand redevelopment was being paid for via a very long term loan from Simon Hallett, as opposed to being paid for by gate receipts, and as such relegation would have little impact on paying off that loan?

I suppose that it all depends on the terms of the loan and how the repayment(s) have been structured. There may be a fixed payment agreement either monthly or annually. Or repayments calculated against annual profit. Or could the loan and interest be held in “trust” to be repayed at the time of sale of the club? So many ifs of buts but whichever way it is a debt to PAFC.

 

[JannerinCardiff]

Bit worried looking at the decline in our crowds this season.. we were getting over 9,500, now it’s about 8,500..

 

[Mark Pedlar]

The costs ate multiple, especially the loss of upward, season-on-season progress, the continued status of 'Same old Argyle' to the wider Plymouth public and the fact that League 2 is not an easy league to get out of.

Eh? But anyone could have got us promoted. And you’d have to be a complete and utter no-hoper to only finish second and blow the title.

Spot on Biggs

 

[oddball]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

I thought that the grandstand redevelopment was being paid for via a very long term loan from Simon Hallett, as opposed to being paid for by gate receipts, and as such relegation would have little impact on paying off that loan?

I suppose that it all depends on the terms of the loan and how the repayment(s) have been structured. There may be a fixed payment agreement either monthly or annually. Or repayments calculated against annual profit. Or could the loan and interest be held in “trust” to be repayed at the time of sale of the club? So many ifs of buts but whichever way it is a debt to PAFC.

In former times chairmen and indeed directors would make interest free loans to the club, however the loan from Simon Hallett is at current market rates.The repayments would kick soon afterwards ....the only income is gate money...

 

[jerryatricjanner]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

I thought that the grandstand redevelopment was being paid for via a very long term loan from Simon Hallett, as opposed to being paid for by gate receipts, and as such relegation would have little impact on paying off that loan?

I suppose that it all depends on the terms of the loan and how the repayment(s) have been structured. There may be a fixed payment agreement either monthly or annually. Or repayments calculated against annual profit. Or could the loan and interest be held in “trust” to be repayed at the time of sale of the club? So many ifs of buts but whichever way it is a debt to PAFC.

In former times chairmen and indeed directors would make interest free loans to the club, however the loan from Simon Hallett is at current market rates.The repayments would kick soon afterwards ....the only income is gate money...

Oddball, back in the day at Argyle a 100k interest free loan was commonplace for a director. The loss of 5k interest per year was nothing really when it got you the best seats in the house home and away, free travel on the team bus, free hospitality, rubbing shoulders with many celebrities etc etc.
Simon Hallett has lent millions which I believe is at a favourable rate of interest saving the club a good sum compared to a commercial loan. There is a difference between the former and latter scenarios.

 

[IJN]

Bit worried looking at the decline in our crowds this season.. we were getting over 9,500, now it’s about 8,500..

It's always been the same, if you do it on the pitch, the Janners will come.

Perhaps, next season, whatever league we will be in, more will turn up because the offering off it is better.

I know it sounds crazy, but I have spoken to a lot of different people over the last three/four years at grounds different and they say that's exactly what happens.

IF and when we get it right on and off the pitch, it should have a very positive impact.

I know it's hard to think past what we're experiencing at the moment but history tells us, it will get better.

 

[Biggs]

Yep, results are the number one driver but I honestly don’t think you can underestimate the effect of somewhere being a nice, modern place to be. Funnily enough, people prefer to spend three hours of their Saturday or so in pleasant surroundings rather than a dilapidated ruin. Especially families.

Look at the difference in footfall between old and new Drake’s Circus shopping centres, no matter what you think of the design (I happen to quite like it).

 

[oldage]

If the team are playing attractive football and winning games I suggest most fans couldn't give a monkeys about how dilapidated the ground is. Conversely whats the point of a nice modern stadium with a rubbish team?

 

[oddball]

Both Argyle and Bradford have huge fan bases for league division 1 and relegation for either or both teams would be disastrous, especially for Argyle who would still have to pay for the grandstand repayments on top of day to day expenses. Season ticket sales would plummet from the current 6000 and sponsors and so on would think twice before well sponsoring...also you would have one hell of a job selling 500 covers in corporate hospitality in league division 2 (corporate hospitality was projected to bring in an extra million pounds a season).....so relegation is not an option.

I thought that the grandstand redevelopment was being paid for via a very long term loan from Simon Hallett, as opposed to being paid for by gate receipts, and as such relegation would have little impact on paying off that loan?

I suppose that it all depends on the terms of the loan and how the repayment(s) have been structured. There may be a fixed payment agreement either monthly or annually. Or repayments calculated against annual profit. Or could the loan and interest be held in “trust” to be repayed at the time of sale of the club? So many ifs of buts but whichever way it is a debt to PAFC.

In former times chairmen and indeed directors would make interest free loans to the club, however the loan from Simon Hallett is at current market rates.The repayments would kick soon afterwards ....the only income is gate money...

Oddball, back in the day at Argyle a 100k interest free loan was commonplace for a director. The loss of 5k interest per year was nothing really when it got you the best seats in the house home and away, free travel on the team bus, free hospitality, rubbing shoulders with many celebrities etc etc.
Simon Hallett has lent millions which I believe is at a favourable rate of interest saving the club a good sum compared to a commercial loan. There is a difference between the former and latter scenarios.

Jerry,Not really, everything is relative at the time....£100K in Daniel's day is £6 million today..the fact is .today's directors don't do interest free loans....so the club will always be at a disadvantage to the director who wants his money back and more....you could say why borrow in the first place when the club is going to be repaying the loan for 30 years. not fair really is it?