Should Tony Cholwell resign?

[monkeywrench]

Tony fight the fight against what you feel insiduous, i'm all for that. The thing is that you are now discussing what you call Argyle related matters as an elected member of PASB. As such you should represent your constituency. A constituency which has told you in no uncertain terms on this site that they dont agree with you. Fight your war Tony, I applaud any man who stands up for what he believes, but to do so you will have to resign. Otherwise the whole representing the fans to the Board is an utter nonsense and the PASB loses its legitimacy (if it ever had any).

Damon I respect your opinion on many things, but I have to say that I couldn't disagree more with your views.

Tony is not an MP. He was voted onto the PASB because he is independent of view, and will not be brow beaten into following the crowd. He was voted on because the PASB is there to ask tough questions of the board and hold them to account. I trust tony completely to do that.

 

[PL2 3DQ]

I see so its best we keep quiet about actions we consider insidious?

So Tony, why have you not included the similar jokes in your post and emails that fans have told you happened at the FanFest and on the terraces at HP?

If you're not consistent, your action is likely to be perceived as driven by a personal dispute rather than a matter of principle.

Tim

Tim, are you posting as an individual or as a Trust leader?
I don't know how or why the Fan Fest (remember the Trust use the GT Suite for their functions) has been brought into this by you and others.

 

[Damon.Lenszner]

Monkey, Tony is not a member of the Trust or any other recognised group and that makes him independent and I applaud that a non aligned person stood for and won a seat om PASB. But he is on PASB to represent the people who voted for him. He is there to be a representative voice of the fans. But he is not being representative of the fans.

I have never had a cross word with Tony. We are not 'mates' but we have spoken on many occassions. I applaud his single mindedness. Like myself he will tell you how he sees it and theres absolutely nothing wrong with that. But if you have voted for a representative voice you want that voice to represent you. I am no apologist for paedophiles. Those that know me will tell you how i have argued for the death penalty for the illegitimates. But a joke is a joke. The jokes are aimed at paedophile savile. They are not taking the mickey out of abused children. People close to me were abused children and have listejed to the jokes and laughed along with them. Censorship is a very dangerous path to walk down. If Tony wants to fight against these jokes he is welcome to do that. But not as an elected representative of Argyle fans who dont want this campaign waged in their name.

 

[Damon.Lenszner]

The reason Ian is that the original post that started this was posted to make ATD look bad because they would not remove Savile jokes on their site. I brought up Fanfests because Rick's act over the past couple of weeks has veen full of Savile jokes. Two hundred and fifty fans in the fanfest, twice. Loads of Savile jokes and not one complaint. Tells me that Argyle fans dont have a proboem with Savile jokes being told. Yet Tony wants Savile jokes banned, writing to civic leaders and the chairman. Not in the name of Argyle he says. But the people of Argyle dont have a proboem with it.

 

[hairy j]

The reason Ian is that the original post that started this was posted to make ATD look bad because they would not remove Savile jokes on their site. I brought up Fanfests because Rick's act over the past couple of weeks has veen full of Savile jokes. Two hundred and fifty fans in the fanfest, twice. Loads of Savile jokes and not one complaint. Tells me that Argyle fans dont have a proboem with Savile jokes being told. Yet Tony wants Savile jokes banned, writing to civic leaders and the chairman. Not in the name of Argyle he says. But the people of Argyle dont have a proboem with it.

Exactly this. Writing to the Chairman and Civic Leaders?!

I hope Tony doesn't verge out into the rest of the internet - he'd probably curl up into a ball of indignation and explode. Don't go on 4Chan Tony, whatever you do.

656 people - you know who you are :thumbdown:

 

[metroace]

Now I don't know what this is all about but I have the following observation.

Just because everyone laughs along and no one says anything does not mean that everyone is actually okay with whatever the situation is. Many times folks just go along with the crowd as they do not want to be seen to be different and it takes real bravery to be the voice that points out how hurtful some things can be.

Just saying.

Just because Tony is elected as a representative does not mean he has to listen to us. If we don't like what he does over the period of his tenure, we don't vote for him next time. This is how elections work.

Calling for resignations because someone is brave enough to raise an issue is daft. That is also a form of censorship.

As I said earlier, I still have no idea what has been said, when and why as no one has enlightened me so the above is an outsiders observation.

Now, lets all keep calm and carry on supporting Argyle.

 

[The Doctor]

I see so its best we keep quiet about actions we consider insidious?

So Tony, why have you not included the similar jokes in your post and emails that fans have told you happened at the FanFest and on the terraces at HP?

If you're not consistent, your action is likely to be perceived as driven by a personal dispute rather than a matter of principle.

Tim

Tim, are you posting as an individual or as a Trust leader?
I don't know how or why the Fan Fest (remember the Trust use the GT Suite for their functions) has been brought into this by you and others.

As one of the 'others' (I think)...

Just for the record, on the Terraces thread I wrote a bit about Fan Fests because some other posts had referred to the type of humour that is prevalent at them and because the nature of that humour was the reason why I wouldn't attend a Fans Fest. It was an illustration of an alternative way of dealing with something which you find insensitive/offensive without launching a campaign against it. It's the same reason why I wouldn't watch a performance by someone like Frankie Boyle or Jim Davidson.

 

[monkeywrench]

Monkey, Tony is not a member of the Trust or any other recognised group and that makes him independent and I applaud that a non aligned person stood for and won a seat om PASB. But he is on PASB to represent the people who voted for him. He is there to be a representative voice of the fans. But he is not being representative of the fans.

I have never had a cross word with Tony. We are not 'mates' but we have spoken on many occassions. I applaud his single mindedness. Like myself he will tell you how he sees it and theres absolutely nothing wrong with that. But if you have voted for a representative voice you want that voice to represent you. I am no apologist for paedophiles. Those that know me will tell you how i have argued for the death penalty for the bar stewards. But a joke is a joke. The jokes are aimed at paedophile savile. They are not taking the mickey out of abused children. People close to me were abused children and have listejed to the jokes and laughed along with them. Censorship is a very dangerous path to walk down. If Tony wants to fight against these jokes he is welcome to do that. But not as an elected representative of Argyle fans who dont want this campaign waged in their name.

No Damon he isn't there to represent all fans. Impossible. He is there because he is trusted to make decisions that he believes are the correct ones. To challenge and argue. To stand up for his beliefs.

That's why I nominated him and that's why I voted for him.

 

[Damon.Lenszner]

Great post Doctor. I have absolutely no problem if people dont enjoy the humour at the fanfest, but lots do and they are the people Rick writes for. Don't enjoy it, don't go but don't stop others having a good time. Good for you Doc.

Understand that Monkey but the message coming across today is that Tony is actually opposing the views of the vast majority, dividing the fanbase, involving civic leaders and linking Argyle with paedophilia more than the original jokes ever did. And whats more having heard the protests digging an ever deeper hole.

 

[hairy j]

Now I don't know what this is all about but I have the following observation.

Just because everyone laughs along and no one says anything does not mean that everyone is actually okay with whatever the situation is. Many times folks just go along with the crowd as they do not want to be seen to be different and it takes real bravery to be the voice that points out how hurtful some things can be.

Just saying.

Just because Tony is elected as a representative does not mean he has to listen to us. If we don't like what he does over the period of his tenure, we don't vote for him next time. This is how elections work.

Calling for resignations because someone is brave enough to raise an issue is daft. That is also a form of censorship.

As I said earlier, I still have no idea what has been said, when and why as no one has enlightened me so the above is an outsiders observation.

Now, lets all keep calm and carry on supporting Argyle.

So why do MPs and Councilors and other elected people resign?

This entire issue isn't anything to do with what Tony sees as being right and correct at all - it's a personal issue between him and another poster on another site that's sparked off on an Evening Herald comments section. So now you know. Considering that, Tony has now tried to use his 'position of power' - he was voted in by 656 people so it's hardly a place on the front bench at the House of Commons - in an attempt to win an internet argument. Is that OK?

If there is any power that the PASB members have (I don't believe there is), Tony's abusing that 'power'.

This thread has had more views than Tony got votes :facepalm:

 

[Tim Chown]

Tim, are you posting as an individual or as a Trust leader?
I don't know how or why the Fan Fest (remember the Trust use the GT Suite for their functions) has been brought into this by you and others.

As an individual.

As others have asked, is Tony posting as the result of an issue between him and poster(s) on ATD, or out of general principle? If he objects to the ATD jokes, does he object to similar jokes elsewhere?

I'm of course a huge fan of the GTs and everything they do. Damon has made good points about the FanFests. The point is whether Tony is being consistent here.

 

[Cult Of Personality]

Yes Tony Cholwell was voted to rep the fan base

Tony has then attacked a group of the fan base how ever small it is he has attacked them and slated them

For me if a MP did this about the people in his town or city they would have to step down

Tony do the right thing step down

I see so its best we keep quiet about actions we consider insidious?

Well, that should get us a long way.

Stand down? I'll be stepping up again.

I am not against you for raising your concerns

But to then post them on this website on the main forum for all the world to see and try and spilt the fan base which you were voted in help i do question

You clearly love the power that you have been given and would happily step on any fans that get in your way

:clap: WELL DONE YOU MAKE PLYMOUTH ARGYLE A CLUB WE ALL WANT TO SUPPORT

 

[PL2 3DQ]

Tim, are you posting as an individual or as a Trust leader?
I don't know how or why the Fan Fest (remember the Trust use the GT Suite for their functions) has been brought into this by you and others.

As an individual.

As others have asked, is Tony posting as the result of an issue between him and poster(s) on ATD, or out of general principle? If he objects to the ATD jokes, does he object to similar jokes elsewhere?

I'm of course a huge fan of the GTs and everything they do. Damon has made good points about the FanFests. The point is whether Tony is being consistent here.

Thanks Tim and Damon.

My issue is that this is nothing to do with Pasoti or the Fan Fests.

Tony's stance is between him and ATD but I note that you are both quick enough to jump in and defend ATD on this thread and yet as regular posters on ATD you are happy enough to say nothing about the daily constant personal attacks and insults on ATD aimed at fans, people at the club or the club itself.

Do you agree with the defamation of character carried out each day on ATD and if you don't agree why haven't you both spoken out as you have done on this thread?

This isn't about choosing a fans' forum, it's about decency on both forums, not just one.

 

[tigertony]

I havn't read the original post/s that created this discussion but I have picked up the words 'jokes' 'saville victims''. I don't know TC at all but like him I speak my mind and tell it how it is - don't like it then fine!!

In this Saville case the biggest jokes are all those people who had the chance to bring his actions to the attention of BBC but when faced with a small brick wall or hurdle promptly turned around and ignored it. If I had evidence of something like that aand my boss or editor said ''forget it - too sensitive - can't wreck the image'' I would have gone straight to the police not hid behind my pay packet.
So I hope that ALL those who knew and stayed quiet are now thoroughly ashamed. :furious:

 

[hairy j]

Tim, are you posting as an individual or as a Trust leader?
I don't know how or why the Fan Fest (remember the Trust use the GT Suite for their functions) has been brought into this by you and others.

As an individual.

As others have asked, is Tony posting as the result of an issue between him and poster(s) on ATD, or out of general principle? If he objects to the ATD jokes, does he object to similar jokes elsewhere?

I'm of course a huge fan of the GTs and everything they do. Damon has made good points about the FanFests. The point is whether Tony is being consistent here.

Thanks Tim and Damon.

My issue is that this is nothing to do with Pasoti or the Fan Fests.

Tony's stance is between him and ATD but I note that you are both quick enough to jump in and defend ATD on this thread and yet as regular posters on ATD you are happy enough to say nothing about the daily constant personal attacks and insults on ATD aimed at fans, people at the club or the club itself.

Do you agree with the defamation of character carried out each day on ATD and if you don't agree why haven't you both spoken out as you have done on this thread?

This isn't about choosing a fans' forum, it's about decency on both forums, not just one.

ATD isn't a person and the Mods don't set a collective agenda - when people accuse pasoti of the same thing, you jump to the defence of the website and (quite rightly) deny that this is the case. This is about one single individual on ATD (the 'known racist' - that's rubbish too and that's defamation) who has deep personal issues with Tony. Tony has used this entire non-issue to continue that personal issue on the Herald comments section and now on pasoti (where this 'known racist' is unable to respond). This is Tony vs Name Removed by Site Admin (the 'known racist').

I'd rather you said that defamation happened by a poster/posters on a forum as opposed to claiming ATD is making defamatory statements.

When the PASB finally meet up one thing they surely cannot allow is for personal vendettas to cloud what they do in the name of the PASB. Another thing they surely cannot allow is for a warped sense of morality to set their agendas. The PASB is apparently there to represent the fans at board level - I apologise for this but not all fans are puritanical Daily Mail reading, moral guardians of goodness.