New shirt - Will be announced Wednesday 29th June. | Page 29 | PASOTI
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New shirt - Will be announced Wednesday 29th June.

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IJN

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Nov 29, 2012
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Confused. 4 turrets 3 towns.

plymouth_castle9.jpg

Built on the western side of Sutton Pool, Plymouth Castle was reported as "a strong castle quadrate, having at each corner a great round tower" with curtain walls four metres high. Its primary defensive purpose was to manage a chain that could be raised to bar access into the harbour (similar arrangements existed at Dartmouth and Fowey). Ships attempting to push through the chain would have been static in the immediate vicinity of the castle and subjected to fire from its guns. A barbican protected the castle's gateway, and possibly also the chain mechanism, giving its name to the now fashionable waterfront area in modern day Plymouth.
 
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Keith Hennessey

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Jul 17, 2006
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Blenheim New Zealand.
Rumour I'm just starting is that the turrets woven into the fabric represent the three towns of the Plymouth City brand and are to get us accustomed to seeing them as they are the begining of a migration away from the Mayflower. Times have changed and much like the issues the Exeter Chiefs had with their branding, Argyle are going to dissaciotate themselves from an image that too some, represents the arrival of colonisation and the suppression of indigenous people.
This sounds familiar.
 
Mar 1, 2005
690
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Southampton
Rumour I'm just starting is that the turrets woven into the fabric represent the three towns of the Plymouth City brand and are to get us accustomed to seeing them as they are the begining of a migration away from the Mayflower. Times have changed and much like the issues the Exeter Chiefs had with their branding, Argyle are going to dissaciotate themselves from an image that too some, represents the arrival of colonisation and the suppression of indigenous people.
I am guessing that this post is just a wind-up, but it illustrates the internet problem that at the other end of the spectrum can lead to the storming of the US Capital Building by insurrectionists who mainly had no idea that they were insurrectionists - you throw out wild speculation based on a grain of truth and some people think "may be" and it grows from there and becomes a stick to beat people with; because people are not wired to think of the balance of the evidence for or against a wild speculation rumour; particularly as we have become used to a decade or so of exactly the same thing, and we all have our biases towards and against the political right and political left.

What is the evidence for, and the evidence against this "rumour" that someone may want to start, even if to plant a seed in someone else's mind?
For -
Some people may wish to eradicate all historical symbols of the oppression of indigenous people by colonisation. These people tend to be on the far left of the political spectrum and our chairman is to the left/liberal side of the political spectrum.
Against -
The Mayflower may not generally be seen as a symbol of oppression of the indigenous American peoples. Indeed, the Pilgrim Fathers may remain very mainstream in American culture which is respected with an annual family orientated bank holiday that is valued and engaged with by the vast majority of American people of all cultures.
As far as I am aware, our chairman has not previously gone on record with extreme far left views. To the contrary he appears to be a capitalist with strong liberal values. This supports the taking of a knee if the players want to engage with it, but does not demand the pulling down of statues or the eradication of historical symbols.
The club wishes to release a strongly innovative players' shirt that reflects the community in which the club sits.
The club wants to be as imaginative as it can be with the symbology of the club. This is "new Argyle", we are different from any other peer club and want to show it.
Turrets have always symbolised the "city" of Plymouth.
The club's crest used to contain the city's turrets. Turrets are nostalgic for the club.
The chairman's old school badge included the city's turrets. He may strongly associate turrets with the city.
The turrets stood against the Nazi blitz. Turrets are nostalgic for the city and the people of Plymouth.
There is probably more.

So, on any jury's evaluation, I would suggest that "beyond any reasonable doubt", the evidence for and against indicates that the inclusion of turrets in the club shirt design is not a first step to the removal of the Mayflower from the club crest because the club sees the Mayflower as a symbol of the oppression of the first American people, or is in any way a first step in softening us up so that this long term plan of removing the Mayflower can be achieved by the club.

The statement was totally ridiculous but written in a way that some people may just think "may be". It deserves to be called out.
 
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MGM

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Dec 7, 2021
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I’m not a a twitter person but noticed the shirt is being announced at 7pm on Wednesday.

Our two signings so far have been around this time. Is there more traction on Twitter in the U.K. in the evenings? Explaining why Argyle are announcing things later? So they get more hits?
 

cheshiregreen

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Feb 17, 2004
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But what is the answer to the big question on football shirts?

When did short sleeves become fashionable and long sleeved football shirts become a thing of the past?
 

Argylegames

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But what is the answer to the big question on football shirts?

When did short sleeves become fashionable and long sleeved football shirts become a thing of the past?
I don't know when it happened but I asked Argyle about long-sleeved shirts a few years back.

The response was that most players want short-sleeved with the choice to wear a long-sleeved baselayer in cold weather. They accepted that some fans would prefer a long-sleeved shirt but the costs of producing both versions made it uneconomic. The majority of fans want the same as the players are wearing.
 
May 16, 2016
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I am guessing that this post is just a wind-up, but it illustrates the internet problem that at the other end of the spectrum can lead to the storming of the US Capital Building by insurrectionists who mainly had no idea that they were insurrectionists - you throw out wild speculation based on a grain of truth and some people think "may be" and it grows from there and becomes a stick to beat people with; because people are not wired to think of the balance of the evidence for or against a wild speculation rumour; particularly as we have become used to a decade or so of exactly the same thing, and we all have our biases towards and against the political right and political left.

What is the evidence for, and the evidence against this "rumour" that someone may want to start, even if to plant a seed in someone else's mind?
For -
Some people may wish to eradicate all historical symbols of the oppression of indigenous people by colonisation. These people tend to be on the far left of the political spectrum and our chairman is to the left/liberal side of the political spectrum.
Against -
The Mayflower may not generally be seen as a symbol of oppression of the indigenous American peoples. Indeed, the Pilgrim Fathers may remain very mainstream in American culture which is respected with an annual family orientated bank holiday that is valued and engaged with by the vast majority of American people of all cultures.
As far as I am aware, our chairman has not previously gone on record with extreme far left views. To the contrary he appears to be a capitalist with strong liberal values. This supports the taking of a knee if the players want to engage with it, but does not demand the pulling down of statues or the eradication of historical symbols.
The club wishes to release a strongly innovative players' shirt that reflects the community in which the club sits.
The club wants to be as imaginative as it can be with the symbology of the club. This is "new Argyle", we are different from any other peer club and want to show it.
Turrets have always symbolised the "city" of Plymouth.
The club's crest used to contain the city's turrets. Turrets are nostalgic for the club.
The chairman's old school badge included the city's turrets. He may strongly associate turrets with the city.
The turrets stood against the Nazi blitz. Turrets are nostalgic for the city and the people of Plymouth.
There is probably more.

So, on any jury's evaluation, I would suggest that "beyond any reasonable doubt", the evidence for and against indicates that the inclusion of turrets in the club shirt design is not a first step to the removal of the Mayflower from the club crest because the club sees the Mayflower as a symbol of the oppression of the first American people, or is in any way a first step in softening us up so that this long term plan of removing the Mayflower can be achieved by the club.

The statement was totally ridiculous but written in a way that some people may just think "may be". It deserves to be called out.
The first line of my post would have saved you from getting RSI.

Internet problem indeed......
 
Jun 4, 2015
2,891
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Ford
I don't know when it happened but I asked Argyle about long-sleeved shirts a few years back.

The response was that most players want short-sleeved with the choice to wear a long-sleeved baselayer in cold weather. They accepted that some fans would prefer a long-sleeved shirt but the costs of producing both versions made it uneconomic. The majority of fans want the same as the players are wearing.
Uneconomic to produce both long and short sleeve shirts, my arse. I bet they don’t cost much more than a couple quid each to make in some Far Eastern factory. How much do the finished items sell for again? I think someone at Argo was telling porkies.
 
Jan 7, 2007
1,753
808
Plymouth
I am guessing that this post is just a wind-up, but it illustrates the internet problem that at the other end of the spectrum can lead to the storming of the US Capital Building by insurrectionists who mainly had no idea that they were insurrectionists - you throw out wild speculation based on a grain of truth and some people think "may be" and it grows from there and becomes a stick to beat people with; because people are not wired to think of the balance of the evidence for or against a wild speculation rumour; particularly as we have become used to a decade or so of exactly the same thing, and we all have our biases towards and against the political right and political left.

What is the evidence for, and the evidence against this "rumour" that someone may want to start, even if to plant a seed in someone else's mind?
For -
Some people may wish to eradicate all historical symbols of the oppression of indigenous people by colonisation. These people tend to be on the far left of the political spectrum and our chairman is to the left/liberal side of the political spectrum.
Against -
The Mayflower may not generally be seen as a symbol of oppression of the indigenous American peoples. Indeed, the Pilgrim Fathers may remain very mainstream in American culture which is respected with an annual family orientated bank holiday that is valued and engaged with by the vast majority of American people of all cultures.
As far as I am aware, our chairman has not previously gone on record with extreme far left views. To the contrary he appears to be a capitalist with strong liberal values. This supports the taking of a knee if the players want to engage with it, but does not demand the pulling down of statues or the eradication of historical symbols.
The club wishes to release a strongly innovative players' shirt that reflects the community in which the club sits.
The club wants to be as imaginative as it can be with the symbology of the club. This is "new Argyle", we are different from any other peer club and want to show it.
Turrets have always symbolised the "city" of Plymouth.
The club's crest used to contain the city's turrets. Turrets are nostalgic for the club.
The chairman's old school badge included the city's turrets. He may strongly associate turrets with the city.
The turrets stood against the Nazi blitz. Turrets are nostalgic for the city and the people of Plymouth.
There is probably more.

So, on any jury's evaluation, I would suggest that "beyond any reasonable doubt", the evidence for and against indicates that the inclusion of turrets in the club shirt design is not a first step to the removal of the Mayflower from the club crest because the club sees the Mayflower as a symbol of the oppression of the first American people, or is in any way a first step in softening us up so that this long term plan of removing the Mayflower can be achieved by the club.

The statement was totally ridiculous but written in a way that some people may just think "may be". It deserves to be called out.
I think it's nice to support those who suffer from Turrets.
 

vibratingspider

Joined 1996
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Oct 1, 2006
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Rumour I'm just starting is that the turrets woven into the fabric represent the three towns of the Plymouth City brand and are to get us accustomed to seeing them as they are the begining of a migration away from the Mayflower. Times have changed and much like the issues the Exeter Chiefs had with their branding, Argyle are going to dissaciotate themselves from an image that too some, represents the arrival of colonisation and the suppression of indigenous people.
Oh dear. I hope that's not the case. The four turrets are from Plymouth Castle, so couldn't it be argued that they were used to suppress the French invaders? I know it's slightly different but also the world has gone bleddy mad.
 
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Jan 22, 2016
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Uneconomic to produce both long and short sleeve shirts, my arse. I bet they don’t cost much more than a couple quid each to make in some Far Eastern factory. How much do the finished items sell for again? I think someone at Argo was telling porkies.
They’d have to place a minimum order though wouldn’t they? Not sure Puma would be letting us buy a dozen long sleeved shirts to keep a few of you happy.
 
Mar 11, 2021
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We are discussing Turrets? They are part of our heritage...be it the towns of Plymouth becoming one...or representing the forts that protected plymouth.
Could be another reason. The point is they've been around years on various institutions and crests. There is nothing wrong with them. They do not link to any insidious past.

The "problem" is the woke snowflake far left want to re-appropriate things/symbols/statues/flags and apply their lens to it all. Sorry you can't.
Before anyone says to me I can't say this...I can. I have no issue with the Liberal movement, what I do take issue with is the far left and indeed the far right. Too many zeitgeist bandwagon merchants.
 

Biggs

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Uneconomic to produce both long and short sleeve shirts, my arse. I bet they don’t cost much more than a couple quid each to make in some Far Eastern factory. How much do the finished items sell for again? I think someone at Argo was telling porkies.

It's not an Argyle thing though, it's a football thing. You just don't see long sleeves anymore, so Argyle would have to ask Puma to produce a totally bespoke non-standard item... for the benefit of a handful of people who might like long sleeves.
 
Feb 21, 2012
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Uneconomic to produce both long and short sleeve shirts, my arse. I bet they don’t cost much more than a couple quid each to make in some Far Eastern factory. How much do the finished items sell for again? I think someone at Argo was telling porkies.
I prefer players to wear long sleeve shirts and i like a collar on a shirt too, sadly it's not the trend now.
 

Bryan Tregunna

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Is everyone on here as interested in interior design as they are with the colour and pattern of the kit?
I wouldn't care if we played in peach trimmed with taupe, it's still Argyle. (Mind you. I wouldn't buy that shirt.)
 
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