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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:00 pm 

Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:33 pm
arrythewurzel wrote:
I hear budget and cheap and Brent in so many posts but wonder how they know? Is player budget published and compared anywhere ? Is there a spending table? Serious question?

If there isn’t, let’s just assume our budget is mid table? I imagine Carey is our top earner. Foxy must be on a whack being former prem man. Ladapo wouldn’t have come here unless the wage was competitive. Wootton was once on Championship wages. We know what these youth players get paid at a Premiership clubs and they won’t have wanted a big cut in pay. So Smith Brown and Moore won’t be cheap either. So I don’t buy the budget argument.

Who are the mid table teams who have household names on high wages who I’d recognise and who are the players we’re missing out on wage wise?


Adams has been quoted in an interview put in the Herald as saying he now had a top ten budget this season.

If that’s true then I really think if Adams is worth his salt we really should be no lower than 14th this season. Still a lot of pts to play for but U must admit I’m worried.


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:27 pm 

Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:44 am
Location: Plymouth
greenking83 wrote:
My god... some people have very short memories.
Yes the current crop of players is poor but to wish for the likes of Mellor, Miller, Tanner and Hartley is fickle beyond belief.

I would agree that times are tough but the night is darkest before the dawn and whilst they arent getting the results required the performances do at least have the embryo of a decent side.
(Defensive calamities aside)

Glass half full.... maybe


I'd happily have Hartley instead of Edwards and/or Wootton.


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:45 pm 

Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 4:47 pm
Cobi Budge wrote:
greenking83 wrote:
My god... some people have very short memories.
Yes the current crop of players is poor but to wish for the likes of Mellor, Miller, Tanner and Hartley is fickle beyond belief.

I would agree that times are tough but the night is darkest before the dawn and whilst they arent getting the results required the performances do at least have the embryo of a decent side.
(Defensive calamities aside)

Glass half full.... maybe


I'd happily have Hartley instead of Edwards and/or Wootton.


I’d even have wotton in his current state ahead of our 3 first choice CB.

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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:34 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:51 pm
Location: Forster NSW
arrythewurzel wrote:
I hear budget and cheap and Brent in so many posts but wonder how they know? Is player budget published and compared anywhere ? Is there a spending table? Serious question?

If there isn’t, let’s just assume our budget is mid table? I imagine Carey is our top earner. Foxy must be on a whack being former prem man. Ladapo wouldn’t have come here unless the wage was competitive. Wootton was once on Championship wages. We know what these youth players get paid at a Premiership clubs and they won’t have wanted a big cut in pay. So Smith Brown and Moore won’t be cheap either. So I don’t buy the budget argument.

Who are the mid table teams who have household names on high wages who I’d recognise and who are the players we’re missing out on wage wise?

Your argument is that no ones knows the budget, yet you use your perception of players wages to make your point, your using the very same budget to ague about a budget you don’t believe!


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:30 am 

Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2011 6:12 pm
Juan wrote:
foreigner wrote:
Juan wrote:
I heard Brent sanctioned new improved contracts for Threlkeld & Bradley but the rest of the board overuled him for financial reasons. If this is true then that decision is criminal given the performances of the clowns we have replaced them with.

Wooton is an absolute liability.
Edwards/Canavan are reminiscent of Titanic trying to do a u-turn.
Moore & Riley aren’t fit to clean Oscar’s boots.


How do they over rule him? Doesn't he have the majority?
( I agree with your assessments of said players).


I’m afraid I don’t have info on the inner workings of argyle board authority/decision making just stating what I was told

I also think the loss of Vyner and the pace he provided compounds our defensive issues.


Unless you were told by someone who was at the board meeting then it’s cobblers. Doubtless in a few weeks time it will be a PAOTI fact though, just like where someone said Adams had stated he had one of the top ten budgets in the division. He hasn’t.


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I don’t understand
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:48 am 
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I dont know but after reading this thread for 5 minutes, the only thing that popped into my head was the Harry Enfield character who use to say "It must be true, fat bloke down the pub said"


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:50 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2003 8:52 pm
Location: London
Tugboat wrote:
greenking83 wrote:
Superguy wrote:
greenking83 wrote:
My god... some people have very short memories.
Yes the current crop of players is poor but to wish for the likes of Mellor, Miller, Tanner and Hartley is fickle beyond belief.

I would agree that times are tough but the night is darkest before the dawn and whilst they arent getting the results required the performances do at least have the embryo of a decent side.
(Defensive calamities aside)

Glass half full.... maybe


Your glass must be half full of some pretty strong stuff mate if you think we have the makings of a decent side!!

Cheers?



Just trying to highlight the knee jerk reactions of some.
To say this is the worst team they have ever seen.... did they not watch any of John Sheridans stint? Or Paul Mariners team?


That was different. Different circumstances surrounding the club. We were struggling off and on the pitch.

It’s was Adams decision to overhaul the squad and his signings. It all feels money related and when you pay peanuts you get monkeys.

How we can moan about budgets when he still has Wylde, Ainsworth, P Grant and Dyson havung not had a look in even thou we’re struggling as much as we are goes to show how poor his recruitment has been. He’s gone for quanity over quality.

The resigning of Fox is still baffling.

So the wages of Fox, P Grant, Ainsworth, Wylde and Dyson would equate to a decent figure. That figure could bring in a real pair of quality players to give us that edge through the middle or composure up top.

Cheap cheap cheap



This is what I keep coming back to. Last season we had a freak injury crisis, which Adams has reacted to this year by massively overinflating the squad.

We've signed way, way, way too many players and it looks like quantity over quality at the moment.

Instead of signing three centre backs to replace Bradley, could we not have gotten one really good one? We signed two right backs to replace Oscar, could we not have signed one and used Sawyer as the back up like we did last year?

Resign Fox on presumably good money - can't get on the pitch, what a waste of money. Could Cameron Sangster not have been our back-up bench midfielder this season?

Ainsworth and Wylde, signed when they were never, ever going to fit into an Adams team and thus never play, what another waste of money.

Peter Grant and Dyson can't even get into a squad, more money wasted.

We've got a youth system which is costing money to maintain, which is literally pointless as Adams doesn't seem to have any intention of ever using it. We made all that fuss about resigning Alex Battle, but why did we bother? If players like him, Fletcher, Sangster especially aren't going to even get on the bench then what on earth is the point? Scrap the entire youth system, we may as well for all the good it's doing us.


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I don’t understand
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:32 am 

Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:41 pm
I just don't understand when a winning formula which had us speed up the division last year castling the likes of Blackburn in the process, he now forgets to implement,... that Carey and Lameiras working off Taylor works... .its proven. . Why does he introduce Taylor and Lameiras after an hour gone, pattern of game set beyond redemption. To me that's idiotic. They are clearly our best attacking option available and he shelves them for a desperate swap when the game has already slipped our grasp, , for what??? Are they injured? Why be sat on the subs bench if so? Crazy.


Last edited by gariboldi on Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:34 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:32 am 

Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:20 pm
Abbotts Ann Green wrote:
Juan wrote:
foreigner wrote:
Juan wrote:
I heard Brent sanctioned new improved contracts for Threlkeld & Bradley but the rest of the board overuled him for financial reasons. If this is true then that decision is criminal given the performances of the clowns we have replaced them with.

Wooton is an absolute liability.
Edwards/Canavan are reminiscent of Titanic trying to do a u-turn.
Moore & Riley aren’t fit to clean Oscar’s boots.


How do they over rule him? Doesn't he have the majority?
( I agree with your assessments of said players).


I’m afraid I don’t have info on the inner workings of argyle board authority/decision making just stating what I was told

I also think the loss of Vyner and the pace he provided compounds our defensive issues.


Unless you were told by someone who was at the board meeting then it’s cobblers. Doubtless in a few weeks time it will be a PAOTI fact though, just like where someone said Adams had stated he had one of the top ten budgets in the division. He hasn’t.



How do you know?


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I don’t understand
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:49 am 
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What all these posts share in common is a sense of bafflement at what DA is doing or trying to acheive. I think it would help a lot if he could be more open and explanatory in his comments, so that we could all get on board (or not) with what he's aiming to do. The Ainsworth/Wylde situation is a case in point. Could he explain what role he has in mind for them? I don't expect a full run down of tactics etc, but a clue as to what and why would be helpful.


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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I don’t understand
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:38 am 
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Lesley Somerville wrote:
What all these posts share in common is a sense of bafflement at what DA is doing or trying to acheive. I think it would help a lot if he could be more open and explanatory in his comments, so that we could all get on board (or not) with what he's aiming to do. The Ainsworth/Wylde situation is a case in point. Could he explain what role he has in mind for them? I don't expect a full run down of tactics etc, but a clue as to what and why would be helpful.

People are forgetting that these two are not new players. He signed them last season and didn't use them then. But they're on two year contracts and no one else wanted them, so we're stuck with them. But they're not playing for the same reason they didn't play last year.

it just baffles me that the players who were brought in to replace the weaker/released players of last year have actually gone on to replace our better/retained players - that's why we're struggling. We've only "lost" two of our contracted players from the side that beat Blackburn (Oscar and Bradley) yet dross like Connor Grant, O'Keefe and Joel Grant are in the side ahead of Lameiras, Fox and Taylor who were key to our revival last term.

Of our signings arguably we've strengthened overall.

Moore / Riley > Miller
Smith-Brown > ATS
Connor Grant > Paton
Ladapo / Dyson > Church / Blisset / No one

The glaring problem, squad-wise, is that none of the CBs are better than Bradley or Vyner but Vyner wasn't ours and only came in to cover for Edwards, who is still with us. Bradley also had his shortcomings, most notably pace, which seems to be the main problem with Wootton and Canavan. There's a decent enough starting XI somewhere in our ranks to stay up but Adams just ain't picking it or playing to its strengths. So the buck stops with him I'm afraid.

And of course Carey has been useless so far. Not a chance will anyone come in for him in January if he keeps playing like he has done.

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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I don’t understand
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:40 am 
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i am going to say this frequently.we have our own talent available.we should be exploiting it. :furious:

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 Post subject: Re: What is going on... I DONT UNDERSTAND
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:54 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:55 am
Mork wrote:
arrythewurzel wrote:
I hear budget and cheap and Brent in so many posts but wonder how they know? Is player budget published and compared anywhere ? Is there a spending table? Serious question?

If there isn’t, let’s just assume our budget is mid table? I imagine Carey is our top earner. Foxy must be on a whack being former prem man. Ladapo wouldn’t have come here unless the wage was competitive. Wootton was once on Championship wages. We know what these youth players get paid at a Premiership clubs and they won’t have wanted a big cut in pay. So Smith Brown and Moore won’t be cheap either. So I don’t buy the budget argument.

Who are the mid table teams who have household names on high wages who I’d recognise and who are the players we’re missing out on wage wise?

Your argument is that no ones knows the budget, yet you use your perception of players wages to make your point, your using the very same budget to ague about a budget you don’t believe!


As we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.

I don't know if our budget is bottom or top .... I'd guess somewhere in the middle. Attendances and the points I make would suggest this. Suggest - no more.

When people post about our bad budget they don't put anything forward in support. Think I'd agree with them if half the team were youth players or signed from the conference.

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