The Old Half Time Smoke Thread

[Argyle sy]

I love the "non-smokers don't have a clue" approach. In all the posts Mark has quoted with a rebuttal he essentially cites "they cater for this addiction, so they should cater for mine" logic. Quoting , alcohol, chocolate (at overinflated compared to high st prices) and the fact the club once allowed gambling but no longer do as reasons you should be allowed to smoke...

Secondhand (passive) smoke unlike the other examples stated above do more than just offend people. It affects everyone else's health. Your passive smoke, after you exhale, still contains approximately 4000 chemicals, 250 are disease causing, 100 of which are toxic and a further 70 are cancerous. This affects children and pregnant ladies worse than adults, in the main. But in adults your secondhand smoke can cause stroke, cancer or heart disease. Yes, if people choose to smoke they can contribute to illness in others. In children it can be ear infections, in pregnancy your second hand smoke has been medically proven to cause SIDS.

Make no joke, passive smoking has a severe affect on the lives of other people, not just that I / we don't like it. Do I like being addicted to chocolate? No, chocolate contains the same chemical that alters the brain as cannabis. Does me eating a chocolate bar or two at half time have the same secondary health affects as smoking? No, my chocolate addiction will not send someone to the GP the next day.

I'm all for smokers being able to run the risks of premature death or illness, that is your choice but when you're addiction has the ability to inflict illness and in the very extreme premature death on others that do not smoke, I'm glad the club (though they are not saying it) say 'public health comes first'.

As has been indicted, smokers are catered for at HP via allowing smoking at the Fanfest. It just so happens to be a personal choice not to take the utility of that provision. Though, clemency should be offered to people with disabilities as I'm all to aware of how an undue long walk can have secondary or tertiary implications a day or two later.

Isondel, it is a matter of fact that non smokers really don't have a clue, and I am not meaning that in a nasty way. Many experts and many studies state that Nicotene is as addictive as Heroin, so no, I fail to see howe someone that has never smoked could have any idea as to the levels of physical and mental addiction that Nicotene causes people, so the whole "they can go 2 hours without a cigarette for 2 hours, surely it can't be that hard" approach is ridiculous. You need to remember that the tobacco companies deliberately make it addictive because that drives up their profits, after all what use would it be to them if it really was as easy as "just go without, it isn't that hard".

 

[Allanon]

Smokers really don't have a clue (see it works both ways)

So you all go out and have your half time fag, return to your seat (next to me) bringing your cloud of pollution with you (on your breath and slowly drifting from your clothing and hair) This aggravates my asthma and starts a fatal asthma attack and I die in the seat beside you, but hey at least your happy because you had your fag...

 

[Andy Holland]

I love the "non-smokers don't have a clue" approach. In all the posts Mark has quoted with a rebuttal he essentially cites "they cater for this addiction, so they should cater for mine" logic. Quoting , alcohol, chocolate (at overinflated compared to high st prices) and the fact the club once allowed gambling but no longer do as reasons you should be allowed to smoke...

Secondhand (passive) smoke unlike the other examples stated above do more than just offend people. It affects everyone else's health. Your passive smoke, after you exhale, still contains approximately 4000 chemicals, 250 are disease causing, 100 of which are toxic and a further 70 are cancerous. This affects children and pregnant ladies worse than adults, in the main. But in adults your secondhand smoke can cause stroke, cancer or heart disease. Yes, if people choose to smoke they can contribute to illness in others. In children it can be ear infections, in pregnancy your second hand smoke has been medically proven to cause SIDS.

Make no joke, passive smoking has a severe affect on the lives of other people, not just that I / we don't like it. Do I like being addicted to chocolate? No, chocolate contains the same chemical that alters the brain as cannabis. Does me eating a chocolate bar or two at half time have the same secondary health affects as smoking? No, my chocolate addiction will not send someone to the GP the next day.

I'm all for smokers being able to run the risks of premature death or illness, that is your choice but when you're addiction has the ability to inflict illness and in the very extreme premature death on others that do not smoke, I'm glad the club (though they are not saying it) say 'public health comes first'.

As has been indicted, smokers are catered for at HP via allowing smoking at the Fanfest. It just so happens to be a personal choice not to take the utility of that provision. Though, clemency should be offered to people with disabilities as I'm all to aware of how an undue long walk can have secondary or tertiary implications a day or two later.

Isondel, it is a matter of fact that non smokers really don't have a clue, and I am not meaning that in a nasty way. Many experts and many studies state that Nicotene is as addictive as Heroin, so no, I fail to see howe someone that has never smoked could have any idea as to the levels of physical and mental addiction that Nicotene causes people, so the whole "they can go 2 hours without a cigarette for 2 hours, surely it can't be that hard" approach is ridiculous. You need to remember that the tobacco companies deliberately make it addictive because that drives up their profits, after all what use would it be to them if it really was as easy as "just go without, it isn't that hard".

Thousands of people stop smoking every day. Stop being so weak and playing the victim, and show some willpower. There's plenty of help out there for people who want to stop.

Unless you don't want to, which is fair enough and completely your right, but society doesn't need to acquiesce to you in any way. We'll keep pushing you further away from people who don't want to inhale your smoke, and you'll have to learn to deal with it.

 

[Guiri Green]

I love the "non-smokers don't have a clue" approach. In all the posts Mark has quoted with a rebuttal he essentially cites "they cater for this addiction, so they should cater for mine" logic. Quoting , alcohol, chocolate (at overinflated compared to high st prices) and the fact the club once allowed gambling but no longer do as reasons you should be allowed to smoke...

Secondhand (passive) smoke unlike the other examples stated above do more than just offend people. It affects everyone else's health. Your passive smoke, after you exhale, still contains approximately 4000 chemicals, 250 are disease causing, 100 of which are toxic and a further 70 are cancerous. This affects children and pregnant ladies worse than adults, in the main. But in adults your secondhand smoke can cause stroke, cancer or heart disease. Yes, if people choose to smoke they can contribute to illness in others. In children it can be ear infections, in pregnancy your second hand smoke has been medically proven to cause SIDS.

Make no joke, passive smoking has a severe affect on the lives of other people, not just that I / we don't like it. Do I like being addicted to chocolate? No, chocolate contains the same chemical that alters the brain as cannabis. Does me eating a chocolate bar or two at half time have the same secondary health affects as smoking? No, my chocolate addiction will not send someone to the GP the next day.

I'm all for smokers being able to run the risks of premature death or illness, that is your choice but when you're addiction has the ability to inflict illness and in the very extreme premature death on others that do not smoke, I'm glad the club (though they are not saying it) say 'public health comes first'.

As has been indicted, smokers are catered for at HP via allowing smoking at the Fanfest. It just so happens to be a personal choice not to take the utility of that provision. Though, clemency should be offered to people with disabilities as I'm all to aware of how an undue long walk can have secondary or tertiary implications a day or two later.

Isondel, it is a matter of fact that non smokers really don't have a clue, and I am not meaning that in a nasty way. Many experts and many studies state that Nicotene is as addictive as Heroin, so no, I fail to see howe someone that has never smoked could have any idea as to the levels of physical and mental addiction that Nicotene causes people, so the whole "they can go 2 hours without a cigarette for 2 hours, surely it can't be that hard" approach is ridiculous. You need to remember that the tobacco companies deliberately make it addictive because that drives up their profits, after all what use would it be to them if it really was as easy as "just go without, it isn't that hard".

You'd have been jiggered at my last work place then. No smoking during working hours - anywhere. No smoking shelters, no little outdoor ashtrays. Addiction or not, unlucky, get over it. There was an understanding of addiction, it came in the form of free assistance in giving up. Blaming tobacco conpanies for making an addictive substance into an addictive substance is a poor excuse for not smoking for a couple of hours. Try a nictotine patch.

 

[Lundan Cabbie]

Knarf Reprah thanks for the support.....it seems that our own little area is still to much of an impact on air quality. .....maybe diesel cars should be banned from the car park as well. On a more serious note I do not condone the dropping of cigarette ends all over the place that is disgusting. My original thread dare I say it was to deal with why Argyle have a different stance than most other clubs......it is my belief that being able to have a cigarette at half time would make a small but noticeable impact on gates....

We won't win, the tree huggers won't broach any other opinion. Fag ends on the floor? Stick a bin outside!
Anyway, addictions? Why not ban alcohol in the ground too.....including corporate areas....bet they wouldn't do that! Apropos the loonies.....it's my choice and uman rite to smoke....surely it's an infringement of basic rights to prevent me from doing so. Imagine the government's horror if we all stopped......the NHS would collapse.

Football supporters are not prisoners in the stadium. If you have to leave then you are allowed to leave. You only have to ask a steward. Your human rights are therefore adequately protected. The club rule of "no re-entry" though cannot be claimed to be against any human right. It therefore comes down to whether you are more addicted to your tobacco or Argyle's second half performances.

 

[Balham Green]

Dont smoke for 2 hours. Sure its not that difficult. Would extend your life expectancy! What annoys me is all those folk who stand outside(e.g. pubs) and you have to walk though a fog of smoke to get inside! On second thoughts keeps smoking. You may be killing yourself but at least loads of money for the tax man.

Are you for real?

Yes am real.

 

[Balham Green]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

 

[GreenArmy1984]

I remember the Argyle Open days from the 90s meeting the players and having look around the stadium etc - Showing my age now !

 

[Penmaster]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

Do you drive a car or any form of fossil fuel burning transport?

 

[Balham Green]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

Do you drive a car or any form of fossil fuel burning transport?

No

 

[Andy Holland]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

Do you drive a car or any form of fossil fuel burning transport?

Was your point going to be "then you're a hypocrite as you're also poisoning the air for people?"

If so, it's ridiculous. Driving is a societal necessity for a myriad of reasons, and pollution caused by it is something with which massive efforts are being taken all the time. It doesn't really compare to your selfish need to hang around by doorways blowing smoke into people's faces, does it?

 

[Balham Green]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

Do you drive a car or any form of fossil fuel burning transport?

Was your point going to be "then you're a hypocrite as you're also poisoning the air for people?"

If so, it's ridiculous. Driving is a societal necessity for a myriad of reasons, and pollution caused by it is something with which massive efforts are being taken all the time. It doesn't really compare to your selfish need to hang around by doorways blowing smoke into people's faces, does it?

The truth hurts Andy. Better to deny it.

 

[Penmaster]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

Do you drive a car or any form of fossil fuel burning transport?

Was your point going to be "then you're a hypocrite as you're also poisoning the air for people?"

If so, it's ridiculous. Driving is a societal necessity for a myriad of reasons, and pollution caused by it is something with which massive efforts are being taken all the time. It doesn't really compare to your selfish need to hang around by doorways blowing smoke into people's faces, does it?

Yes that was my point and I think it is far from ridiculous. I don't smoke and I do drive a car, but surely someone who doesn't drive would be just as entitled to complain about the air contamination caused by burning fuel than a non smoker complaining about smokers smoking in open air in public. I can't fathom how you can't see the parallels.

 

[Balham Green]

Presto, I acknowledge my cloths, hair etc stink enough to know it can make some non smokers feel ill, although can't smell it on other smokers.

Flip side of your coin is if your not a smoker you can't appreciate the level of addiction, to a legal drug. There has to be a compromise. What has been suggested is just that and works well at most lower league grounds.

Ballham you don't like walking through smoke outside buildings? It was non smokers who campaigned to make smokers go outside the doors! Pre 2007 we were more than happy smoking inside! In buildings other than pubs, often in designated rooms and areas, you can't have it both ways.

As a non smoker I have a right to be able to walk through a door without having to inhale others' possibly cancer causing chemicals. It defeats the object of the exercise if they all stand right outside the door. Re the addiction element I get its is difficult to give up but dont believe the symptoms are anywhere near as bad as those giving up e.g heroin.

Do you drive a car or any form of fossil fuel burning transport?

Was your point going to be "then you're a hypocrite as you're also poisoning the air for people?"

If so, it's ridiculous. Driving is a societal necessity for a myriad of reasons, and pollution caused by it is something with which massive efforts are being taken all the time. It doesn't really compare to your selfish need to hang around by doorways blowing smoke into people's faces, does it?

Yes that was my point and I think it is far from ridiculous. I don't smoke and I do drive a car, but surely someone who doesn't drive would be just as entitled to complain about the air contamination caused by burning fuel than a non smoker complaining about smokers smoking in open air in public. I can't fathom how you can't see the parallels.

I can't fathom how you can see the parallels. Are you saying smoking is a necessity or driving a car isn't??

 

[Guiri Green]

I don't smoke but I drive a really old diesel tobacco delivery lorry - nobody likes me