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Will Cummings bring Johnson down?

Dec 27, 2004
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Bidford on Avon
I think you're either fishing EO, or deflecting - lefties eh. Maybe both. Johnson isn't really even a Tory - where the ideology is centred around family and duty, when has Johnson anything for the good of others rather than himself? Never. His consistent bare-faced lying, lack of respect for anything and lack of integrity and any sort of morals is finally being reported, after being largely supressed for many years by the largely Tory press. Tugendhat or Mercer would be a far better option. Truss is a shapeshifting, bland blancmange who makes Starmer look like 007
 
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Nov 15, 2011
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You will know and now , the lefties on here, certainly for the most part, and certainly for me, always despised corbyn and his stupid 6th form student politics.
He didn’t want to win elections and change the world, just have endless campaigning for whatever cause he fancied at the time.

But your lazy assumption that they are all the same, well you couldn’t tell me one way that rayner had misled you. You just don’t like her and wheel out the tired old cliches parroting whatever your social media echo chamber tells you.

What she did leaving school at 16 and having a child and getting to where she is today from the poorest of backgrounds is utterly remarkable and the opposite of Johnson’s entitled Eton privileged upbringing where everything was given to him on a plate. It’s truely remarkable that the poorest people doffed their caps to their “betters” and voted for someone who they knew would lie to them, despise them and pick their pockets.
 
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Dec 9, 2021
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Its not a lazy assumption at all. If you had stepped outside of your own echo chamber you would have known about the time she tried to throw her own Leader under the bus. Her actions are almost a mirror image of the way Gove threw Johnson under the bus. You probably do remember that but for some unknown reason have chosen to ignore it. I wonder why that is.

In my opinion, Rayner’s behaviour is snaky. It’s also said that she’s been briefing against Starmer and recent events have outed her as untrustworthy and slippery and someone that was caught red-handed playing both sides, although she managed to bluster her way out of that.

She operates in exactly the same way as any other politician. She is only interested in feathering her own nest. Where she comes from is irrelevant. In fact, it could be argued that the fact she has come from where she has, could mean that she would do even more to hang on to a position such as the PM or Labour Party Leader.
 
Feb 26, 2012
1,827
228
Ivybridge
Come the revolution!

The thing is, all joking aside, revolution is the only way things will get changed and the likelihood of that happening anytime soon is pure fantasy. You can only effect change at this level from the inside and when you only have the political parties that we have to choose from then as I said earlier, irrespective of whomever is in the chair, their conduct will still be pretty much the same. They will always look to feather their own nests and tell whatever lies are necessary to achieve their aims.

It has nothing to do with being defeatist but everything to do with recognising that having a little march here or ousting a politician there will not achieve anything. Its simply a case of rinse and repeat.

I just thank the stars that Corbyn never reached No.10. Imagine the lies that would have been coming out of his mouth when he's trying to push his own agenda and convince the British people that we don't need a nuclear deterrent.

I wonder if the lefties on this forum would have been so vitriolic towards him as they are/have been to Johnson. I guess we'll never know but I'd wager they wouldn't be.
I think things will change EO, not dramatically at the next election (although I really hope they do) but I think as demographics change and issues such as climate change finally gain traction there will be a move towards those who genuinely support green policies, those who support the NHS and the welfare state and, dare I say it, those who see our future with Europe and not the USA. The Tories core support is elderly and resistant to change, beyond this group they have little appeal.

We can agree on Corbyn, a decent man I think but an electoral liability. I think you underestimate the objectivity of your average 'leftie'. Most of us are slightly left of centre so tend to be moderate and reasonable in our views...Johnson and his cabal are some considerable way to the right and have stoked up a full on culture war and hold views and practice behaviours that people like me find abhorrent. There are and always have been decent conservatives, but unfortunately they have little influence in the current set up. Johnson like Trump has normalised lying (alternative facts?) and is supported by an inner circle that will do anything to hold on to power. He will go soon I suspect but it will not be game over...his eventual replacement will inevitably be cut from the same cloth.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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I don’t have an echo chamber I read the mail and times and other outlets.

But you have no evidence she is feathering her own nest do you, none whatsoever, you just made it up, no evidence she misled anyone, you just made that up too and just don’t like her because that’s what you’ve been told by people who don’t like people on the left, particularly women and poor people getting above their station. All you have is some right wing nonsense gossip about her and Starmer.

And you trot out again the lazy cliche they’re all the same with no evidence whatsoever cos you’ve been told this by people who are trying to excuse the lying corrupt cowardly clown that they’ve persuaded you wouldn’t pick your pockets.
 
Apr 15, 2004
2,933
278
East Devon
It has nothing to do with being defeatist but everything to do with recognising that having a little march here or ousting a politician there will not achieve anything. Its simply a case of rinse and repeat.
Sorry but it really is defeatist and fortunately it is clearly wrong. Finally, it seems Johnson's abuse of his position has cut thru' to the public and the the anger has done him real damage this time and may yet finish him. Even if it doesn't actually bring him down then it has, for now, marked a boundary that he and other politicians will think twice about crossing again. Simply ignoring it with a cynical shrug would be a green light to God knows what further liberties being taken (quite literally).

OK. You might believe most of our other politicians would be just as bad or even worse. You may be right - but that completely misses the point. It is the democratic duty of all of the checks on executive power to push back hard whenever the government abuses its position. That means parliament, the judiciary, the independent watchdogs, a free press and last but most importantly of all - us, the public, to protest loudly. If we just sit back expecting and accepting the worst from our leaders then that is precisely what we'll get - and the day will come when we will long for the likes of Boris Johnson.
 
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Dec 9, 2021
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I think things will change EO, not dramatically at the next election (although I really hope they do) but I think as demographics change and issues such as climate change finally gain traction there will be a move towards those who genuinely support green policies, those who support the NHS and the welfare state and, dare I say it, those who see our future with Europe and not the USA. The Tories core support is elderly and resistant to change, beyond this group they have little appeal.

We can agree on Corbyn, a decent man I think but an electoral liability. I think you underestimate the objectivity of your average 'leftie'. Most of us are slightly left of centre so tend to be moderate and reasonable in our views...Johnson and his cabal are some considerable way to the right and have stoked up a full on culture war and hold views and practice behaviours that people like me find abhorrent. There are and always have been decent conservatives, but unfortunately they have little influence in the current set up. Johnson like Trump has normalised lying (alternative facts?) and is supported by an inner circle that will do anything to hold on to power. He will go soon I suspect but it will not be game over...his eventual replacement will inevitably be cut from the same cloth.
Unfortunately, I agree with you OG.
 

Daz

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Sep 30, 2003
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I laughed out loud when I saw this front page for tomorrow.
 

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Jan 20, 2004
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Its not a lazy assumption at all. If you had stepped outside of your own echo chamber you would have known about the time she tried to throw her own Leader under the bus. Her actions are almost a mirror image of the way Gove threw Johnson under the bus. You probably do remember that but for some unknown reason have chosen to ignore it. I wonder why that is.

In my opinion, Rayner’s behaviour is snaky. It’s also said that she’s been briefing against Starmer and recent events have outed her as untrustworthy and slippery and someone that was caught red-handed playing both sides, although she managed to bluster her way out of that.

She operates in exactly the same way as any other politician. She is only interested in feathering her own nest. Where she comes from is irrelevant. In fact, it could be argued that the fact she has come from where she has, could mean that she would do even more to hang on to a position such as the PM or Labour Party Leader.
Your last paragraph is absurd, but why should someone who has experienced poverty and the hardships in life and used those experiences to fight for a better life for others want to hang on to "power" more than a privileged Etonian prick who has been bred to believe he is entitled to lead the country ? I'd argue the opposite.

And to counter some of your previous points (also covered by Ave it) no, not all politicians are liars. Some actually have morals and ethics that guide their principles, unlike Johnson. They may make promises they find difficult to keep, due to circumstance when they find themselves in the driving seat, but that doesn't make them a liar if they can't fulfill them.
 
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Dec 9, 2021
226
88
Your last paragraph is absurd, but why should someone who has experienced poverty and the hardships in life and used those experiences to fight for a better life for others want to hang on to "power" more than a privileged Etonian prick who has been bred to believe he is entitled to lead the country ? I'd argue the opposite.
Maybe it’s not absurd after all🤷‍♂️
 
Nov 15, 2011
2,293
434
Labour deputy leader wants to get into power and stay in power to help and represent the poorest in society, what an awful woman.

Better stick with the compulsive liar, adulterer and coward whose only thought every day his own self gratification, eventually betraying everyone he's ever known to stay in power a few more hours.

It's just incredible that the people who they hurt most, doff their caps and tug their forelocks to those that not only despise them but pick their pockets every day.

But they're all the same.
 
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Pogleswoody

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Yes I did it. I'm pretending to be really sorry. I really need to stay on as PM cos I haven't finished decorating No 10 yet.

So the question remains of my punishment:
How many Junior Ministers and Civil Servants do I need to sack to get out of this? :unsure:
 
Dec 9, 2021
226
88
Labour deputy leader wants to get into power and stay in power to help and represent the poorest in society, what an awful woman.

Better stick with the compulsive liar, adulterer and coward whose only thought every day his own self gratification, eventually betraying everyone he's ever known to stay in power a few more hours.

It's just incredible that the people who they hurt most, doff their caps and tug their forelocks to those that not only despise them but pick their pockets every day.

But they're all the same.
Exactly. At least we can agree on one thing.
 
Nov 15, 2011
2,293
434
Exactly. At least we can agree on one thing.
I was being ironic as I have demonstrated they are polar opposites, but I do get some people say that cos it excuses them to some extent in having voted for a bunch of lying crooks who despise them. And since they were told at the time what Johnson and his lot were like - not least on here - to admit they were conned so easily, well they're not ready for that. Yet.