Torquay 0-4 St Albans City | PASOTI
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Torquay 0-4 St Albans City

Brussels Bureaucrat

Cream First
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Jun 16, 2017
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Ixelles/The City of Plymouth
A proper miserable season for the Gulls isn't it? St Albans are on a decent run so an away win was by no means unexpected, but for a club with Torquay's history to be played off the park like that is pretty grim. A United-supporting friend of mine says it's toxic on and off the pitch.
 
May 22, 2006
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It's sad but kind of inevitable. There was always this clutch of clubs down the bottom of Division 4 - Halifax, Torquay, Aldershot, Scarborough, Hartlepool, York, etc - who managed to survive only because automatic relegation and promotion from Non-League didn't exist.

As soon as that safety net was taken away, the writing was on the wall for clubs of that stature. So many clubs have overtaken them now. Unfortunately their current status does reflect the true size and realistic ambition of the club. It's a shame, Plainmoor is by far my favourite away ground, but they were always diminutive.
 
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Jul 29, 2010
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It's sad but kind of inevitable. There was always this clutch of clubs down the bottom of Division 4 - Halifax, Torquay, Aldershot, Scarborough, Hartlepool, York, etc - who managed to survive only because automatic relegation and promotion from Non-League didn't exist.

As soon as that safety net was taken away, the writing was on the wall for clubs of that stature. So many clubs have overtaken them now. Unfortunately their current status does reflect the true size and realistic ambition of the club. It's a shame, Plainmoor is by far my favourite away ground, but they were always diminutive.
For the avoidance of doubt, you are saying that's a good thing right?

A closed shop is no good for football, at any level, it should be a meritocracy. It may have been bad for Torquay but has been good for better run more upwardly mobile clubs.

Its precisely that sense of 'privilege' that has been their undoing in the NLS. I've been following it closely, and whereas Yeovil and Maidstone came down and adapted Gulls came down with a "we're Torquay United, we're full time in a mainly part time league so give us the points please" attitude.

The manager doesn't help, Gary Johnson is a proper dinosaur, incapable of adapting to modern football and is often run rings round by younger more progressive managers operating with nothing like the resources he's got. He's slagged off the players and the fans throughout and takes no responsibility. It really is toxic there.

Off the field and Plainmoor is the biggest worry. It seems they have a mini Goldstone ground thing going on... an owner on the brink of acquiring the freehold from the council who has indicated the area can't support a full time club with a ground where it is. Anyone smell housing development?

It is sad, I'd hate to be in their shoes. Malevolent owner aside though, I have huge sympathy there, if you aren't good enough, if you can't adapt, if you employ an anachronism for a manager... this is just what happens.
 
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May 22, 2006
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For the avoidance of doubt, you are saying that's a good thing right?

A closed shop is no good for football, at any level, it should be a meritocracy. It may have been bad for Torquay but has been good for better run more upwardly mobile clubs.

Its precisely that sense of 'privilege' that has been their undoing in the NLS. I've been following it closely, and whereas Yeovil and Maidstone came down and adapted Gulls came down with a "we're Torquay United, we're full time in a mainly part time league so give us the points please" attitude.

The manager doesn't help, Gary Johnson is a proper dinosaur, incapable of adapting to modern football and is often run rings round by younger more progressive managers operating with nothing like the resources he's got. He's slagged off the players and the fans throughout and takes no responsibility. It really is toxic there.

Off the field and Plainmoor is the biggest worry. It seems they have a mini Goldstone ground thing going on... an owner on the brink of acquiring the freehold from the council who has indicated the area can't support a full time club with a ground where it is. Anyone smell housing development?

It is sad, I'd hate to be in their shoes. Malevolent owner aside though, I have huge sympathy there, if you aren't good enough, if you can't adapt, if you employ an anachronism for a manager... this is just what happens.
Oh goodness, yes. It's a wonderful thing.

Before there were dozens of well-run Conference clubs who couldn't go any further because of a glass ceiling, while the basket cases at the bottom of D4 clung on for dear life. That was totally unfair. Now we have some proper social mobility.
 
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Brussels Bureaucrat

Cream First
✅ Evergreen
Jun 16, 2017
2,837
1,995
Ixelles/The City of Plymouth
For the avoidance of doubt, you are saying that's a good thing right?

A closed shop is no good for football, at any level, it should be a meritocracy. It may have been bad for Torquay but has been good for better run more upwardly mobile clubs.

Its precisely that sense of 'privilege' that has been their undoing in the NLS. I've been following it closely, and whereas Yeovil and Maidstone came down and adapted Gulls came down with a "we're Torquay United, we're full time in a mainly part time league so give us the points please" attitude.

The manager doesn't help, Gary Johnson is a proper dinosaur, incapable of adapting to modern football and is often run rings round by younger more progressive managers operating with nothing like the resources he's got. He's slagged off the players and the fans throughout and takes no responsibility. It really is toxic there.

Off the field and Plainmoor is the biggest worry. It seems they have a mini Goldstone ground thing going on... an owner on the brink of acquiring the freehold from the council who has indicated the area can't support a full time club with a ground where it is. Anyone smell housing development?

It is sad, I'd hate to be in their shoes. Malevolent owner aside though, I have huge sympathy there, if you aren't good enough, if you can't adapt, if you employ an anachronism for a manager... this is just what happens.

I've got the impression they'd love to get rid.of Johnson but they haven't got the cash, is that right?

They managed to lose at home to Wotton's Truro on Boxing Day, that must have been absolutely miserable. The sort of club they played in half-speed pre-season friendlies for decades.
 
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Jul 29, 2010
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Even if they had cash to spend, from the outside at least, the impression is the owners lack the interest to intervene and thus risk improving things.

Allowing the club to whither on the vine suits the narrative required to justify scaling down the operation and moving away from Plainmoor.
 
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demportdave

🍌 Bomber Harris.
Jul 6, 2005
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The situation at Torquay is very sad. I have always liked Torquay and somewhat patronisingly, have always regarded them as that nice little club up the road. I have never quite felt the same way about Exeter.

From a selfish perspective, it would probably be a good thing for Argyle if Torquay were a top National League or League 2 club again. We could loan our younger players to them - as we did with Randell a few seasons back - and perhaps have first dibs on any of their good youngsters.

As a Championship club, our youngsters need to be playing at a higher standard than National League South.

Sadly, under the current ownership and Management, a return even to the National League seems a long way off.

The current owner appears to have an agenda where the success of the football club is not his priority.