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I think Labour has got it wrong

I want this opposition to do well, but their current economic strategy looks very wobbly to me.

Firstly, to oppose an increase in corporation tax at this moment is wrong. Any company which emerges from this recession making profits is in a very good position, and given the country’s needs should hardly complain at paying a little more over the short term. There are also companies which have done very well from the pandemic, supermarkets, on-line suppliers of all kinds, pharmaceuticals etc, and again they can hardly resent contributing more to help reduce the national debt burden.

Secondly, the bond idea just doesn’t make sense. The best way to get the nation’s amassed savings back into circulation and create more jobs and investment is to encourage us to spend it directly, not via a bond where government decides where to invest it. Too slow, too cumbersome. It’s also a scheme which will only appeal to the better off. Many families will emerge from this recession lucky to have fifty quid in the bank, and they are the people who need the help urgently.

Great respect for Keir Starmer, but I think he’s off-course here.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Very much agreed Mervyn, I pay corporation tax , why should I pay less tax than a nurse or a teacher? It doesn't make sense particularly for the Labour Party. Besides Ireland we have the lowest CT rate in Europe, we have to pay back the debt somehow and for business tax rates to at least be the same as other workers seems a no brainer.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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You make it sound as if this is a 1st :lol: Labour has been getting it wrong on many fronts and over a long period of time imo. The Conservatives don't really have to do anything to convince voters on where to put their 'X' come election day as Labour keep shooting themselves in the foot with their in-house squabbling and complete lack of direction and leadership.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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I think it says more about the electorate. The Brexit con, worst death rate in the world, worst economic harm of any developed country yet half the country still vote against their own interest because Bozo the clown waves a Union Jack , even though he doesn't have an ounce of patriotism, a compulsive liar, his entire life shows the only thing he cares about is him being "king of the world", but people get what they deserve.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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themightykeithfear":20p423qh said:
I think it says more about the electorate. The Brexit con, worst death rate in the world, worst economic harm of any developed country yet half the country still vote against their own interest because Bozo the clown waves a Union Jack , even though he doesn't have an ounce of patriotism, a compulsive liar, his entire life shows the only thing he cares about is him being "king of the world", but people get what they deserve.
So you agree then that Labour are a woeful bunch? I mean, if a clown can convince the electorate then how bad must Labour be? Or are you saying the voting majority are just sheep and only people that vote Labour have the capacity to think for themselves? :think:
 
Nov 15, 2011
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The voters had a choice of bozo and jezza , how did it come to that! Neither are anywhere near to being fit to run the country. Starmer has won back 20 points but I still think he’s wrong on this issue.
The footballification of politics is pathetic where people cheer on their guy even when they know he’s a cultist or liar. Shankly was wrong some things are more important than football and it’s desperately sad our country has got itself into the current mess rather than someone serious, boring even, in charge who actually has the interests of the people at heart.
 
Sep 6, 2006
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Pottypilgrim":47s032dy said:
themightykeithfear":47s032dy said:
I think it says more about the electorate. The Brexit con, worst death rate in the world, worst economic harm of any developed country yet half the country still vote against their own interest because Bozo the clown waves a Union Jack , even though he doesn't have an ounce of patriotism, a compulsive liar, his entire life shows the only thing he cares about is him being "king of the world", but people get what they deserve.
So you agree then that Labour are a woeful bunch? I mean, if a clown can convince the electorate then how bad must Labour be? Or are you saying the voting majority are just sheep and only people that vote Labour have the capacity to think for themselves? :think:

Its very obvious even to the biased/deluded. The clown can win the electorate because of huge backing from the Murdoch press/media which are happy to peddle his lies and make him out to be a cuddly figure with all this 'Boris' stuff. Unfortunately the electorate fall for it in a similar way Trump's supporters did. Ultimately the provinces voted as a protest against the EU when it was the Tory Government of the previous 10 years responsible for their predicament. Unbelievable. Turkeys voting for Xmas.
 
Sep 6, 2006
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Pottypilgrim":127tc82o said:
You make it sound as if this is a 1st :lol: Labour has been getting it wrong on many fronts and over a long period of time imo. The Conservatives don't really have to do anything to convince voters on where to put their 'X' come election day as Labour keep shooting themselves in the foot with their in-house squabbling and complete lack of direction and leadership.


'Getting it wrong over a long period of time'. How about the longest recession since the 1930s under the Tories? Guess they got that right.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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themightykeithfear":1c9s5vr1 said:
The voters had a choice of bozo and jezza , how did it come to that! Neither are anywhere near to being fit to run the country. Starmer has won back 20 points but I still think he’s wrong on this issue.
The footballification of politics is pathetic where people cheer on their guy even when they know he’s a cultist or liar. Shankly was wrong some things are more important than football and it’s desperately sad our country has got itself into the current mess rather than someone serious, boring even, in charge who actually has the interests of the people at heart.
:lol: I think this happens a lot nowadays. I remember saying something similar about 4 years back when the US had the choice of Clinton or Trump. Voting nowadays seems to be all about damage limitation. Which candidate can mess up the Country the less :D Fwiw, I think, all things considered, that the Conservatives have had a good stab at navigating the Country through this pandemic. Let's not forget that this is something quite unprecedented and it can be argued that we have managed it far better than a great number of other Countries. Brexit is also something that is quite unprecedented and so far it doesn't seem to have been managed too badly...I appreciate that it is early days yet though. I'm not entirely convinced that if Labour were in the hotseat then things would have worked out in the same way. I guess thats something that we'll never know though.
 
Sep 6, 2006
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Pottypilgrim":1j0pjykd said:
themightykeithfear":1j0pjykd said:
The voters had a choice of bozo and jezza , how did it come to that! Neither are anywhere near to being fit to run the country. Starmer has won back 20 points but I still think he’s wrong on this issue.
The footballification of politics is pathetic where people cheer on their guy even when they know he’s a cultist or liar. Shankly was wrong some things are more important than football and it’s desperately sad our country has got itself into the current mess rather than someone serious, boring even, in charge who actually has the interests of the people at heart.
:lol: I think this happens a lot nowadays. I remember saying something similar about 4 years back when the US had the choice of Clinton or Trump. Voting nowadays seems to be all about damage limitation. Which candidate can mess up the Country the less :D Fwiw, I think, all things considered, that the Conservatives have had a good stab at navigating the Country through this pandemic. Let's not forget that this is something quite unprecedented and it can be argued that we have managed it far better than a great number of other Countries. Brexit is also something that is quite unprecedented and so far it doesn't seem to have been managed too badly...I appreciate that it is early days yet though. I'm not entirely convinced that if Labour were in the hotseat then things would have worked out in the same way though. I guess thats something that we'll never know though.

Wow!! 'Managed it far better' !!! I'm gobsmacked. Where have you been last 12 months?
 
Nov 15, 2011
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"the Conservatives have had a good stab at navigating the Country through this pandemic." !!!
Its like saying black is white, how have they done this to you? The combination of highest death rate in the world, highest number of deaths in Europe by far and worst economic outcome of any developed country means that the Conservatives have handled the pandemic worse than any of the other 195 countries on the entire planet. We have nil points and I can't see how anyone can't see that.

And we watched it all unfold in disbelief, with the late lockdowns, care homes scandal, Bozo shaking hands with Covid patients, test and trace farce, PPE debacle, billions in cash for mates who didn't deliver which you and I will be paying off for the rest of our lives, saving Christmas that killed 40,000 people, its never ending. Bozo is a brilliant conman I'll give you that !
 
Sep 2, 2008
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You don't seem to have taken into account the 'unprecedented' bit. Also, there is a huge factor that you seem to be overlooking and that is the number of people who failed to play their part in containing this virus. Those people that flouted all advice/rules and still went about their business as they have always done. You can put all the measures in place possible but if people ignore what they are being told then there is very little else you can do. The measures to protect had to be put in place gradually. It had to be an iterative process otherwise there would have been people bumping their gums about not treating people as adults or the govt were imposing something akin to martial law. The people themselves have to take a large part of the responsibility for the death rate but I guess we can't say that can we, after all, we don't tend to take responsibility for our own actions nowadays do we. Its always someone else's fault.
 
Feb 21, 2011
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Pottypilgrim":oo83s1y4 said:
themightykeithfear":oo83s1y4 said:
I think it says more about the electorate. The Brexit con, worst death rate in the world, worst economic harm of any developed country yet half the country still vote against their own interest because Bozo the clown waves a Union Jack , even though he doesn't have an ounce of patriotism, a compulsive liar, his entire life shows the only thing he cares about is him being "king of the world", but people get what they deserve.
So you agree then that Labour are a woeful bunch? I mean, if a clown can convince the electorate then how bad must Labour be? Or are you saying the voting majority are just sheep and only people that vote Labour have the capacity to think for themselves? :think:
i simply put it down to selfishness, the 40 odd percent that vote tory are doing ok they are spaced around the country in such a fashion that they win more seats i heard the term protectionist conservative once and i think it about sums it up, a sort of i'm alright selfish attitude, they care little about the corruption, the cronyism, the lies, the sell off of the NHS, the enviroment etc because they can still have 2 holidays a year and drive a relatively reliable car, until the system changes so every vote actually counts it will be ever thus. Cornwall is a classic example voters are unrepresented 6 tory MPs with only 54% of the vote no other parties got a look in, the system is flawed.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Pottypilgrim":dqh4ee9k said:
You don't seem to have taken into account the 'unprecedented' bit. Also, there is a huge factor that you seem to be overlooking and that is the number of people who failed to play their part in containing this virus. Those people that flouted all advice/rules and still went about their business as they have always done. You can put all the measures in place possible but if people ignore what they are being told then there is very little else you can do. The measures to protect had to be put in place gradually. It had to be an iterative process otherwise there would have been people bumping their gums about not treating people as adults or the govt were imposing something akin to martial law. The people themselves have to take a large part of the responsibility for the death rate but I guess we can't say that can we, after all, we don't tend to take responsibility for our own actions nowadays do we. Its always someone else's fault.

Oh I see it was only unprecedented in this country, not the other 195 , oh its all clear now. And all the things I listed, the corruption, late decisions etc etc were all our fault , its only in the UK that people didn't take responsibility. Mate have you ever thought of a life in politics , the lot in charge would love someone like you to join the team.

And how ironic that the people going on about losing their freedom, muzzles et al are predominately in..................................... the Conservative Party including many of their MPs !
 
Sep 2, 2008
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themightykeithfear":30shpb15 said:
Pottypilgrim":30shpb15 said:
You don't seem to have taken into account the 'unprecedented' bit. Also, there is a huge factor that you seem to be overlooking and that is the number of people who failed to play their part in containing this virus. Those people that flouted all advice/rules and still went about their business as they have always done. You can put all the measures in place possible but if people ignore what they are being told then there is very little else you can do. The measures to protect had to be put in place gradually. It had to be an iterative process otherwise there would have been people bumping their gums about not treating people as adults or the govt were imposing something akin to martial law. The people themselves have to take a large part of the responsibility for the death rate but I guess we can't say that can we, after all, we don't tend to take responsibility for our own actions nowadays do we. Its always someone else's fault.

Oh I see it was only unprecedented in this country, not the other 195 , oh its all clear now. And all the things I listed, the corruption, late decisions etc etc were all our fault , its only in the UK that people didn't take responsibility. Mate have you ever thought of a life in politics , the lot in charge would love someone like you to join the team.

And how ironic that the people going on about losing their freedom, muzzles et al are predominately in..................................... the Conservative Party including many of their MPs !

Comparisons are all well and good if all things are equal but they're not, so comparing the UK with other Countries is pointless. For example, Belgium has the highest mortality rate per capita so it could be argued that the UK isn't the worst 'performer' in Europe. Also, you are seeming to forget that a scientific body was set up to advise the Govt on the approach to take including when to impose restrictions/lockdowns so how you can point the finger at the Govt on that is incredible. I suspect you have different reasons for your need to point the finger as you do and its those which are preventing you from taking a step back and taking a more balanced look at the situation. I also find it interesting that you choose to ignore the fact that the UK is outperforming all of Europe (possibly the World) when it comes to the number of people vaccinated but then again, I guess that little snippet wouldn't suit your agenda.