• Welcome to PASOTI (Sponsored by GA Solictors and Lang & Potter)
  • Hello guests - don't forget that by registering and signing up for Pasoti you'll see less adverts plus receive extras like free match tickets, taking part in polls, joining in the chat room and more. Come and join us!

How do we stop immigrants dying?

Nov 15, 2011
2,353
443
Apolgies.

I thought the discussion was about the tragic loss of lives of refugees trying to reach the UK. I naturally assumed it wasn't 'yet another' drift into attacking the Government and Boris Johnson. We'd understand and sympathise if he really was your Stepdad and you really were the angry teenage son who blames him for the divorce and every ill since then, some of us have been there too, some possibly on both sides. I guess he and you aren't in that situation but forgive us for thinking that's how you come across.

Once again, apologies, I've obviously got my priorities wrong. I won't trouble you again.
I was answering your specific point but the answer to the question is don't have a joke of a PM, the let the bodies pile high man, who doesn't have the slightest interest in saving lives but just wants a headline from his client journalists depicting him as the big French hating tough guy.
 
Sep 6, 2006
12,170
780
Trying to set aside the issue of economic migration (a symptom of globalisation), I’ve always believed that anyone in fear of their safety should surely feel protected in the nearest safe haven.

If you’re an asylum seeker can there be any justification to travel further than a safe place? And if you do, do you then become an economic migrant by default?

This to me is the crux of the problem - why these unfortunate people feel the need to risk their lives, and placing themselves in the hands of god knows who, by typically yomping through half of Europe just to reach the UK.

France doesn’t want the responsibility and therefore make their conditions as unbearable as possible. Then the combination of a little English language knowledge and the promise of fair treatment sees them take life threatening risks to reach our shores.

The only solution I can see is to create proper safe harbours in countries that neighbour dictatorships etc. and do it properly this time. The EU, UK and others should work together, invest sufficiently and give these poor people a life closer to home. In the end that investment would be wise given the costs associated with accommodating asylum seekers and the inherent risks to the people themselves. Any other options simply address the symptoms, not the cause.

Otherwise it will never stop.
It will never stop whilst there are massive income disparities. Perhaps many of them, most, are economic migrants. So what? There is a big disconnect here. We have big labour shortages, young people who want to come and here and work and we try to stop them. And if they get here we don't allow them to work. Unbelievable!
 
It will never stop whilst there are massive income disparities. Perhaps many of them, most, are economic migrants. So what? There is a big disconnect here. We have big labour shortages, young people who want to come and here and work and we try to stop them. And if they get here we don't allow them to work. Unbelievable!
It was reported yesterday that of those migrants already processed, (painfully few I know), 70% of them were proven genuine asylum seekers fleeing real threats to their own and their families’ lives. And I agree, what if the balance are economic migrants? We’ve lost significant numbers of overseas workers following Brexit, and these replacements could pay taxes and contribute to our economy doing jobs which our indigenous population is totally unwilling to do.
 
May 16, 2016
4,143
452
It will never stop whilst there are massive income disparities. Perhaps many of them, most, are economic migrants. So what? There is a big disconnect here. We have big labour shortages, young people who want to come and here and work and we try to stop them. And if they get here we don't allow them to work. Unbelievable!
Quite. Why turn away cheap labour prepared to do the jobs we're not prepared to do.
 
May 16, 2016
4,143
452
It was reported yesterday that of those migrants already processed, (painfully few I know), 70% of them were proven genuine asylum seekers fleeing real threats to their own and their families’ lives. And I agree, what if the balance are economic migrants? We’ve lost significant numbers of overseas workers following Brexit, and these replacements could pay taxes and contribute to our economy doing jobs which our indigenous population is totally unwilling to do.
We could just try advertising and enducement rather than rely on misery, suffering and the encouragement of criminal activity to fill vacancies.

It's OK chaps, leave your family, risk everything, give your money, identity and life to traffickers, traipse halfway across the world because Brexit has teething problems.

Blimey.
 
Apr 15, 2004
2,939
283
East Devon
Can anyone believe we have a PM that in the wake of such a horrifying tragedy chooses to conduct delicate but vital negotiations with our closest neighbour via Twitter? Twitter FFS!? I mean ..... WTF? How would we have reacted if Macron had done that? (Except of course Macron is a serious, grown-up politician so he never would).

Every time Johnson does something so appallingly stupid and misjudged I think he can't get any worse.....Then he does! UN-BE-LIEV-ABLE! The sooner the Tories finally dump this clown (as they will) the better for all of us... not least those poor souls.

On the subject of why the people risk their lives to leave a safe country to get to us.... Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it because the UK insists asylum applications can only be made here? You cannot claim asylum from abroad. So if someone believes they have a better chance of acceptance in the UK (maybe they can speak English to effectively plead their case and/or have family links to support them) then isn't that a good reason if they'll be rejected in France? These are desperate, desperate people. Who knows where they get their information from? Yet the sort of right wing morons that won't even have a Covid jab here are the very first to point the finger of blame calling THEM stupid and reckless.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mike E
Nov 15, 2011
2,353
443
We could just try advertising and enducement rather than rely on misery, suffering and the encouragement of criminal activity to fill vacancies.

It's OK chaps, leave your family, risk everything, give your money, identity and life to traffickers, traipse halfway across the world because Brexit has teething problems.

Blimey.
No one is encouraging criminal activity though the U.K. immigration policy of not allowing claims outside our shores makes it much more likely.

And Brexit isn’t teething problems, the barriers to trade are for good and are only half done. Wait until January when everything coming into the U.K. is stopped, quantity and quality checked, duties and VAT, and tariffs where rules of origin don’t qualify. Inflation, shortages, delays, you ain’t seen nothing yet.
 
Jan 26, 2004
3,660
11
Brisbane, Australia
Various counties have been mentioned, and in nearly all cases those countries weren't aware of such ideas (e.g. Albania). And, yes, Denmark is looking at such a scheme with Rwanda being the only likely country - but under International Law Denmark would still be completely responsible for the care and protection of those individuals, and nobody is entirely sure of whether people in those camps would be under Danish or Rwandan law. What we can't have are the kinds of camps - and the problems they created - used by Australia.
Why, the system worked pretty well in Australia and saved countless hundreds/thousands of lives. Also put the people smugglers out of business.

25,000 + getting into the UK this year and the death rate is increasing. Signals suggestion is on the money, time to take the honey off the table.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Guiri Green
Nov 15, 2011
2,353
443
Why, the system worked pretty well in Australia and saved countless hundreds/thousands of lives. Also put the people smugglers out of business.

25,000 + getting into the UK this year and the death rate is increasing. Signals suggestion is on the money, time to take the honey off the table.
The Australian system hasn’t worked pretty well or saved thousands of lives. It’s a cruel expensive inhumane system that wouldn’t even be allowed in the U.K. because it would be in breach of the HRA. It has cost billions of dollars and is characterised by physical and mental torture.

if getting the honey off the table is treating human beings like animals it’s a no from me.
 
Sep 6, 2006
12,170
780
Why, the system worked pretty well in Australia and saved countless hundreds/thousands of lives. Also put the people smugglers out of business.

25,000 + getting into the UK this year and the death rate is increasing. Signals suggestion is on the money, time to take the honey off the table.
So is 25000 a problem in one of the richest countries in the world with a pop of over 60 million? Drop in the ocean.
 
Sep 6, 2006
12,170
780
That’s the ones lucky enough to make it. What about the hundred/ thousands that perish at sea? you seem to be ok with that!!
Where did I say I was ok with that? You seem to be imagining things. You mentioned the 25000 plus which you seem to have a problem with.
 
Nov 15, 2011
2,353
443
There speaks a person that hasn’t a clue. You are totally wrong. Go educate yourself. Carry on watching the deaths at sea.
Hmmm I did receive a good education thankyou. The way to stop the deaths is to ensure a safe passage so they can make their claims, not to torture people.
 
Jan 26, 2004
3,660
11
Brisbane, Australia
Safe passage, how many millions do you envisage, or do you have a specific number in mind? Royal Navy escorts….no that won’t work, so many laid up.
LONDON — Five of the Royal Navy’s Type 45 destroyers are unavailable for deployment, leaving just one warship in the class capable of operations, defense procurement minister Jeremy Quin acknowledged this week.
Such a sad state of affairs.
 
Last edited: