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Coronavirus (merged threads)

Oct 9, 2003
3,499
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Aberdeen
Pogleswoody":2xsmy4hv said:
Pottypilgrim":2xsmy4hv said:
Pogleswoody":2xsmy4hv said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed?? :think:

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....
 

Pogleswoody

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Frank_Butcher":13zl613d said:
Pogleswoody":13zl613d said:
Pottypilgrim":13zl613d said:
Pogleswoody":13zl613d said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed??

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....[/quote

Well as I walk past my local school every day and as my neighbour is a nurse whose kid is at the school, I did know that.

Crikeyonabike: sometimes you just use a phrase like 'schools open' 'schools closed' as 'shorthand' in a debate. I don't know who gains from a pedantic Alan B'stard like response: Well schools aren't actually open Vivien!' So there!!

I haven't played it back but I'm sure our beloved PM used the same phrases 'schools closed'. But hey ho .. do I really care?

But I'll take your advice Frank: 'General Opening' it is! Thanks! :thumbup:

(Waits for pedantic: Well for your info smartpants, Vivien was in the Young Ones not The New Statesman. Put that in your kif pipe and smoke it you lefty hippy! :lol:)
 
Sep 2, 2008
1,792
21
Frank_Butcher":1w4qxs35 said:
Pogleswoody":1w4qxs35 said:
Pottypilgrim":1w4qxs35 said:
Pogleswoody":1w4qxs35 said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed?? :think:

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.
 

Pogleswoody

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Pottypilgrim":136tj3oo said:
Frank_Butcher":136tj3oo said:
Pogleswoody":136tj3oo said:
Pottypilgrim":136tj3oo said:
Pogleswoody":136tj3oo said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed?? :think:

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.

The schools aren't closed!
 

Willis88

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Jan 17, 2017
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Frank_Butcher":2yiw7n9z said:
Pogleswoody":2yiw7n9z said:
Pottypilgrim":2yiw7n9z said:
Pogleswoody":2yiw7n9z said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed?? :think:

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

Mate who's a teacher has a nearly full class.

They broadened the definition of key worker and now applies if only one of the parents is a key worker (before it was 2).

Lockdown 1 he had 7 kids, this lockdown 26.
 
Sep 25, 2010
2,664
88
Pottypilgrim":3xdyumi1 said:
Frank_Butcher":3xdyumi1 said:
Pogleswoody":3xdyumi1 said:
Pottypilgrim":3xdyumi1 said:
Pogleswoody":3xdyumi1 said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed?? :think:

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.

What is wrong with that, teachers must be able to work safely. Why you are making it a political issue, is beyond me.

Teachers are teachers irrespective of their party allegiances

Teachers along with police, should be given the vaccine now, I would be giving up my vaccine in order for them, to get it now.
If we give teachers the vaccine, the schools would go back quicker, then everybody would be happy.
 
Martyn":30up9sf2 said:
Pottypilgrim":30up9sf2 said:
Frank_Butcher":30up9sf2 said:
Pogleswoody":30up9sf2 said:
Pottypilgrim":30up9sf2 said:
Pogleswoody":30up9sf2 said:
So Boreass is saying today: 'No-one has worked harder than me and the Secretary of Education to get/keep schools open'.

He then taunts Starmer asking him to confirm that schools are 'safe'.

But if schools are safe why are they closed?? :think:

Schools are not closed. .

So how can he and the SoS be working so hard to open them? :think:

Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.

What is wrong with that, teachers must be able to work safely. Why you are making it a political issue, is beyond me.

Teachers are teachers irrespective of their party allegiances

Teachers along with police, should be given the vaccine now, I would be giving up my vaccine in order for them, to get it now.
If we give teachers the vaccine, the schools would go back quicker, then everybody would be happy.

Spot on. My daughter teaches A level students in the East End, where virus rates have been the highest in the country, particularly amongst the large BAME community. She and her husband, also a teacher, stuck to it, but predicted that her catching the virus was almost inevitable. It drives me mad hearing politicians/commentators say that schools are safe, so let’s return. Sure, they’re safe for children, most of whom in her school were asymptomatic, but not for adults.

When she caught it we were very worried. She’s 49 and was quite ill.

If you were her, or her immediate family, why wouldn’t you want the vaccine as a priority group? I appreciate there are many other front line workers, but how many of them will know that as a direct result of doing their job they are virtually guaranteed to get it.
 

Pogleswoody

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Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....[/quote]

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.[/quote]

What is wrong with that, teachers must be able to work safely. Why you are making it a political issue, is beyond me.

Teachers are teachers irrespective of their party allegiances

Teachers along with police, should be given the vaccine now, I would be giving up my vaccine in order for them, to get it now.
If we give teachers the vaccine, the schools would go back quicker, then everybody would be happy.[/quote]

Spot on. My daughter teaches A level students in the East End, where virus rates have been the highest in the country, particularly amongst the large BAME community. She and her husband, also a teacher, stuck to it, but predicted that her catching the virus was almost inevitable. It drives me mad hearing politicians/commentators say that schools are safe, so let’s return. Sure, they’re safe for children, most of whom in her school were asymptomatic, but not for adults.

When she caught it we were very worried. She’s 49 and was quite ill.

If you were her, or her immediate family, why wouldn’t you want the vaccine as a priority group? I appreciate there are many other front line workers, but how many of them will know that as a direct result of doing their job they are virtually guaranteed to get it.[/quote]

So serious question Merv (or Frank etc. anyone who can write sensibly and reply without 'anger'):

Schools aren't safe? Labour want teachers vaccinated?
So how/why can Boreass taunt Keir Starmer at PMQT to say that schools aren't safe?

.... and why can't Starmer just stand up and say: 'No I(we) don't believe that schools are (currently) safe (Which is why they are not generally open)?'

I'm missing something tbh. I can understand that Labour don't want to undermine the overall Govt strategy of beating the virus but a little disagreement and opposition (from The Opposition!) goes a long way now and again surely in a democracy?
 
Oct 9, 2003
3,499
11
Aberdeen
mervyn":1rnk7p04 said:
My daughter teaches A level students in the East End, where virus rates have been the highest in the country, particularly amongst the large BAME community. She and her husband, also a teacher, stuck to it, but predicted that her catching the virus was almost inevitable. It drives me mad hearing politicians/commentators say that schools are safe, so let’s return. Sure, they’re safe for children, most of whom in her school were asymptomatic, but not for adults.

When she caught it we were very worried. She’s 49 and was quite ill.

If you were her, or her immediate family, why wouldn’t you want the vaccine as a priority group? I appreciate there are many other front line workers, but how many of them will know that as a direct result of doing their job they are virtually guaranteed to get it.

Quite agree mervyn. I would prioritise police, teachers and other frontline public service staff. For me they should have been prioritised over back office NHS staff, many of whom I know have been vaccinated even though they are nowhere near the frontline themselves. I realise that won't be popular with some.

I'm sure everyone has war stories. My daughter received the vaccine this week which I was very pleased about given she works for a homeless housing association and is often working with very vulnerable people. Yet my mother at 81 with a bronchial condition has not had the vaccine. Her mental health is suffering because she feels she's been forgotten (partly due to a certain local politician). But there is nowhere to go to clarify if that is true or not. Most likely not of course, but how do I convince her? We, meanwhile, are caring for someone extremely vulnerable at the moment but won't get the vaccine ourselves for some time (and I'm referring here to the risks for them, not us).

The challenge is that there are so many groups you could prioritise - based on age, wellbeing, professional job role, informal carers, ethnicity etc. etc.. You cannot - unfortunately - prioritise everybody.
 
Pogleswoody":6wdijpvm said:
Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.[/quote]

What is wrong with that, teachers must be able to work safely. Why you are making it a political issue, is beyond me.

Teachers are teachers irrespective of their party allegiances

Teachers along with police, should be given the vaccine now, I would be giving up my vaccine in order for them, to get it now.
If we give teachers the vaccine, the schools would go back quicker, then everybody would be happy.[/quote]

Spot on. My daughter teaches A level students in the East End, where virus rates have been the highest in the country, particularly amongst the large BAME community. She and her husband, also a teacher, stuck to it, but predicted that her catching the virus was almost inevitable. It drives me mad hearing politicians/commentators say that schools are safe, so let’s return. Sure, they’re safe for children, most of whom in her school were asymptomatic, but not for adults.

When she caught it we were very worried. She’s 49 and was quite ill.

If you were her, or her immediate family, why wouldn’t you want the vaccine as a priority group? I appreciate there are many other front line workers, but how many of them will know that as a direct result of doing their job they are virtually guaranteed to get it.[/quote]

So serious question Merv (or Frank etc. anyone who can write sensibly and reply without 'anger'):

Schools aren't safe? Labour want teachers vaccinated?
So how/why can Boreass taunt Keir Starmer at PMQT to say that schools aren't safe?

.... and why can't Starmer just stand up and say: 'No I(we) don't believe that schools are (currently) safe (Which is why they are not generally open)?'

I'm missing something tbh. I can understand that Labour don't want to undermine the overall Govt strategy of beating the virus but a little disagreement and opposition (from The Opposition!) goes a long way now and again surely in a democracy?
[/quote]

A fair question, which I think has a simple answer. I’ve shouted at Starmer over the last two PMQs to just say what I’ve said above. Schools are safe for kids but not for teachers. I think he’s over-thought his response because of bumbling Boris’s jibe that he’s in thrall to the teaching unions. Grrrrrr.
 
May 8, 2011
4,628
36
mervyn":ecalre3b said:
Pogleswoody":ecalre3b said:
Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.

What is wrong with that, teachers must be able to work safely. Why you are making it a political issue, is beyond me.

Teachers are teachers irrespective of their party allegiances

Teachers along with police, should be given the vaccine now, I would be giving up my vaccine in order for them, to get it now.
If we give teachers the vaccine, the schools would go back quicker, then everybody would be happy.[/quote]

Spot on. My daughter teaches A level students in the East End, where virus rates have been the highest in the country, particularly amongst the large BAME community. She and her husband, also a teacher, stuck to it, but predicted that her catching the virus was almost inevitable. It drives me mad hearing politicians/commentators say that schools are safe, so let’s return. Sure, they’re safe for children, most of whom in her school were asymptomatic, but not for adults.

When she caught it we were very worried. She’s 49 and was quite ill.

If you were her, or her immediate family, why wouldn’t you want the vaccine as a priority group? I appreciate there are many other front line workers, but how many of them will know that as a direct result of doing their job they are virtually guaranteed to get it.[/quote]

So serious question Merv (or Frank etc. anyone who can write sensibly and reply without 'anger'):

Schools aren't safe? Labour want teachers vaccinated?
So how/why can Boreass taunt Keir Starmer at PMQT to say that schools aren't safe?

.... and why can't Starmer just stand up and say: 'No I(we) don't believe that schools are (currently) safe (Which is why they are not generally open)?'

I'm missing something tbh. I can understand that Labour don't want to undermine the overall Govt strategy of beating the virus but a little disagreement and opposition (from The Opposition!) goes a long way now and again surely in a democracy?
[/quote]

A fair question, which I think has a simple answer. I’ve shouted at Starmer over the last two PMQs to just say what I’ve said above. Schools are safe for kids but not for teachers. I think he’s over-thought his response because of bumbling Boris’s jibe that he’s in thrall to the teaching unions. Grrrrrr.[/quote]


According to the recent televised Downing Street briefing schools are safe for teachers, there is no evidence that they are more likely to get the virus at work then in other settings and there is no evidence if they catch it in school it is from a colleague or from a pupil.

If teachers below 50 are to get the vaccine now, who in the current categories 1-9 of those at much higher clinical risk of severe illness and death should be delayed in getting the vaccine?
 
HC Green":m28e9uag said:
mervyn":m28e9uag said:
Pogleswoody":m28e9uag said:
Schools are open for children of key workers in a controlled environment (the obvious advantage being fewer pupils). Just a hunch but I suspect he wants the general opening of schools as soon as possible for the benefit of all of our childrens' education. But maybe you knew that already Pogles....

They are having real issues with teacher Unions and headteachers who don't want their members/colleagues to be put at risk and local governments (mainly Labour controlled) who don't agree with the decision to open any schools.

What is wrong with that, teachers must be able to work safely. Why you are making it a political issue, is beyond me.

Teachers are teachers irrespective of their party allegiances

Teachers along with police, should be given the vaccine now, I would be giving up my vaccine in order for them, to get it now.
If we give teachers the vaccine, the schools would go back quicker, then everybody would be happy.

Spot on. My daughter teaches A level students in the East End, where virus rates have been the highest in the country, particularly amongst the large BAME community. She and her husband, also a teacher, stuck to it, but predicted that her catching the virus was almost inevitable. It drives me mad hearing politicians/commentators say that schools are safe, so let’s return. Sure, they’re safe for children, most of whom in her school were asymptomatic, but not for adults.

When she caught it we were very worried. She’s 49 and was quite ill.

If you were her, or her immediate family, why wouldn’t you want the vaccine as a priority group? I appreciate there are many other front line workers, but how many of them will know that as a direct result of doing their job they are virtually guaranteed to get it.[/quote]

So serious question Merv (or Frank etc. anyone who can write sensibly and reply without 'anger'):

Schools aren't safe? Labour want teachers vaccinated?
So how/why can Boreass taunt Keir Starmer at PMQT to say that schools aren't safe?

.... and why can't Starmer just stand up and say: 'No I(we) don't believe that schools are (currently) safe (Which is why they are not generally open)?'

I'm missing something tbh. I can understand that Labour don't want to undermine the overall Govt strategy of beating the virus but a little disagreement and opposition (from The Opposition!) goes a long way now and again surely in a democracy?
[/quote]

A fair question, which I think has a simple answer. I’ve shouted at Starmer over the last two PMQs to just say what I’ve said above. Schools are safe for kids but not for teachers. I think he’s over-thought his response because of bumbling Boris’s jibe that he’s in thrall to the teaching unions. Grrrrrr.[/quote]


According to the recent televised Downing Street briefing schools are safe for teachers, there is no evidence that they are more likely to get the virus at work then in other settings and there is no evidence if they catch it in school it is from a colleague or from a pupil.

If teachers below 50 are to get the vaccine now, who in the current categories 1-9 of those at much higher clinical risk of severe illness and death should be delayed in getting the vaccine?[/quote]

You’re right HC that there is no evidence that teachers are more likely to catch the virus, because no agency is able to provide such data when you report that you’ve caught the virus. The NHS doesn’t ask your profession when you report in, so Johnson’s statement is true, but disingenuous.
 
Time to stand corrected! The BBC’s ‘more or less’ programme this morning has just announced NSO statistics which confirm conclusively that teachers are at no significantly greater risk than any other front line staff. Haven’t told my daughter yet (she’s out delivering food packages to the families of poorer pupils), but I hope she’ll be relieved.
 
Dec 27, 2004
710
24
Bidford on Avon
Before people misinterpret this post as a crackpot antivaxxer post it's the exact opposite.

I'm amazed that this hasn't been discussed further.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/22 ... niversity/

On our local news BBC WM and in the above link - it was reported that the effectiveness of lateral flow tests was investigated on Birmingham University students and it was found that these were 3% effective in confirming Covid infection - 97% of students who were infected were not detected and most likely went home and enjoyed Christmas as such.

"About 7200 took up the offer during the first week in December, and one-tenth of them, chosen at random, were also given a PCR test to verify the accuracy of the lateral flow tests.

The lateral flow tests indicated that 0.03 per cent of the students had the coronavirus. But in the smaller fraction who had a PCR test, the prevalence was much higher, at 0.86 per cent"

"This is much lower than previously reported sensitivity levels for this type of test. The sensitivity was 57 per cent when it was used in a mass-screening pilot in Liverpool, UK, and more than 70 per cent when it was checked in UK government laboratories, according to a spokesperson for the UK’s Department of Health and Social Care"

That's extremely worrying considering that these will soon be available for employees of businesses with >= 50 employees.

If you marketed a a spot cream that was only 3% effective would you bother to buy it?

Testing is an absolute must to bring the virus under control, but it has to be accurate and people need to still be very, very cautious and maintain their hands, face, space.

I'm extremely fortunate that I can work remotely, but people need to exercise extreme caution with these tests.

As I say this is not anti - it's making people aware that lateral flow tests are highly inaccurate with a best detection rate noted at ~70% in the best case scenario.

This really is the sort of thing people need to be aware of if we are to get this horrible virus under control