Camara made available for transfer

[Tugboat]

Genuinely feel like he’s moving a year or 2 too early.

He’ll go on to earn more money, given. But I don’t think he will get as much game time in a championship team. In essence less developing in the medium term.

It’s clear he doesn’t want to stay so I’m not really bothered where he goes providing the fees are meet. Shame really because money isn’t everything. His agent has arguably done his job in trying to get the best price but at what non financial expense to the player.

 

[JannerinCardiff]

The forwards get pretty good service. Because they are incapable of winning a header or holding the ball up it keeps coming back.

I don't think the forwards generally get great service myself.

 

[JannerinCardiff]

I don't understand the hate for his finishing, only 4 players in the team scored more goals than him in all competitions this season, 3 of them forwards. It's not what he is in the team to do. Roy Keane scored 33 in 336 matches for Utd, Patrick Viera scored 29 in 279 for Arsenal, Kante has 11 in 181 for Chelsea. Not Saying Pan is at their level, just none of them really contributed to their teams efforts with goals and Keane/Viera were pivotal in probably the two best premier league teams ever to exist. Kante carried Leicester to a Premier league title and then went to Chelsea and did the same the very next year. But when Pan doesn't score 15 goals a season on top of everything else he does, he's not good enough? Ridiculous.

Aren't all 3 of your examples of Keane, Viera and Kante defensive type midfielders? - Pan plays number 8 with a specific defensive midfielder behind him. He should have more relative goal contributions than any of those players you've listed purely based on he fact he starts higher up the pitch.

 

[Balham Green]

I don't think the forwards generally get great service myself.

Have you not seen the amount of times they get bullied off the ball or fail to win a header? Watching different game to me.
In Camara and Mayor plus the attacking wing backs we have good players to provide an excellent service.

 

[JannerinCardiff]

Have you not seen the amount of times they get bullied off the ball or fail to win a header? Watching different game to me.
In Camara and Mayor plus the attacking wing backs we have good players to provide an excellent service.

I also see a lot of poor long balls played to forwards expecting them to perform minor miracles to do anything with.

the problem isn’t the forwards so much but the way they are given the ball. If we had better ball playing defenders and a play making CDM we could give the forwards the ball more often the way that they would like to receive it rather that aimless hoofs downfield a lot of the time.

 

[Balham Green]

I also see a lot of poor long balls played to forwards expecting them to perform minor miracles to do anything with.

the problem isn’t the forwards so much but the way they are given the ball. If we had better ball playing defenders and a play making CDM we could give the forwards the ball more often the way that they would like to receive it rather that aimless hoofs downfield a lot of the time.

Sure it's not perfect. Work in progress. But the strikers need to do a lot more. Can't always rely on long balls down the channel for Hardie to chase.

 

[Emu]

I also see a lot of poor long balls played to forwards expecting them to perform minor miracles to do anything with.

the problem isn’t the forwards so much but the way they are given the ball. If we had better ball playing defenders and a play making CDM we could give the forwards the ball more often the way that they would like to receive it rather that aimless hoofs downfield a lot of the time.

Very good post, nail on the head.

 

[Balham Green]

Very good post, nail on the head.

Yeah but unfortunately we do not have the budget to sign Beckenbauer type players who can not only defend, as they did last season, but have great distribution also. Asking too much.

 

[Knibbsworth]

Aren't all 3 of your examples of Keane, Viera and Kante defensive midfielders? - Pan plays number 8 with a specific defensive midfielder behind him. He should have more relative goal contributions than any of those players you've listed purely based on he fact he starts higher up the pitch.

Keane and Viera played in centre midfield duos, so they weren’t defensive midfielders, they were box to box midfielders.

 

[Deacster]

Keane and Viera played in centre midfield duos, so they weren’t defensive midfielders, they were box to box midfielders.

However they generally sat, as opposed to being box to box, especially as they got older. Keane for example, sat while Scholes pushed on. For Argyle, Houghton sits to allow Canara and Mayor to push on.

That's why his goal output is poor and being held up as a reason this may not be the worst thing in the world.

 

[Knibbsworth]

However they generally sat, as opposed to being box to box, especially as they got older. Keane for example, sat while Scholes pushed on. For Argyle, Houghton sits to allow Canara and Mayor to push on.

That's why his goal output is poor and being held up as a reason this may not be the worst thing in the world.

He didn't sit at all, his primary attributes were stamina, energy, tenacity and movement.

He probably didn't score as many as Scholes because he couldn't clout it in the top corner from 25 yards.

He scored 55 goals in the top flight for Nottingham Forest and Manchester United without having a decent long range strike on him, or taking set pieces. I think that suggests he got himself in the box a fair bit and made more than the occasional forward run.

 

[Deacster]

He didn't sit at all, his primary attributes were stamina, energy, tenacity and movement.

He probably didn't score as many as Scholes because he couldn't clout it in the top corner from 25 yards.

He scored 55 goals in the top flight for Nottingham Forest and Manchester United without having a decent long range strike on him, or taking set pieces. I think that suggests he got himself in the box a fair bit and made more than the occasional forward run.

He did sit, he was more box to box at Notts Forest and perhaps in his early Man Utd career but was in the holding role once Paul Ince left with Scholes pushed on.

 

[Knibbsworth]

He did sit, he was more box to box at Notts Forest and perhaps in his early Man Utd career but was in the holding role once Paul Ince left with Scholes pushed on.

Well Keane's Wikipedia page remembers him as a "dominating box-to-box midfielder, noted for his aggressive and highly competitive style of play".
Keane himself in an interview with Gary Neville said he never regarded himself as a world class player, all he thought he did was run around a lot, show desire and put a foot in (which any other player could have done).

On This Day | A Roy Keane double sinks Arsenal | August. 22. 1999

#OnThisDay #Arsenal #KeaneOn this day in 1999 Two goals from Roy Keane gives Manchester United a huge victory over title rivals Arsenal.If you enjoyed the vi...

m.youtube.com

These goals are not typical positions for a midfielder who has been asked to just sit and screen the back four. You won't catch Jordan Houghton making runs like those. Keane was always a busy player, like Pan Camara, always moving and on his way somewhere.

 

[Deacster]

Well Keane's Wikipedia page remembers him as a "dominating box-to-box midfielder, noted for his aggressive and highly competitive style of play".
Keane himself in an interview with Gary Neville said he never regarded himself as a world class player, all he thought he did was run around a lot, show desire and put a foot in (which any other player could have done).

On This Day | A Roy Keane double sinks Arsenal | August. 22. 1999

#OnThisDay #Arsenal #KeaneOn this day in 1999 Two goals from Roy Keane gives Manchester United a huge victory over title rivals Arsenal.If you enjoyed the vi...

m.youtube.com

These goals are not typical positions for a midfielder who has been asked to just sit and screen the back four. You won't catch Jordan Houghton making runs like those. Keane was always a busy player, like Pan Camara, always moving and on his way somewhere.

Regardless, funny how things go off on a tangent and here we are comparing a fairly average Argyle player to one of the best midfielders ever to play the game

 

[JannerinCardiff]

Well Keane's Wikipedia page remembers him as a "dominating box-to-box midfielder, noted for his aggressive and highly competitive style of play".
Keane himself in an interview with Gary Neville said he never regarded himself as a world class player, all he thought he did was run around a lot, show desire and put a foot in (which any other player could have done).

On This Day | A Roy Keane double sinks Arsenal | August. 22. 1999

#OnThisDay #Arsenal #KeaneOn this day in 1999 Two goals from Roy Keane gives Manchester United a huge victory over title rivals Arsenal.If you enjoyed the vi...

m.youtube.com

These goals are not typical positions for a midfielder who has been asked to just sit and screen the back four. You won't catch Jordan Houghton making runs like those. Keane was always a busy player, like Pan Camara, always moving and on his way somewhere.

Houghton plays behind two number 8’s and just in front of a 3 man defence, which means he rarely gets beyond Mayor or Pan (or whoever plays those positions). Keane played predominantly in a 4-4-2 system where he had licence to occasionally go forward.