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BLM, Taking a knee and THAT symbol of racism

GreenThing

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Sep 13, 2003
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Plymouth
Point of order.

I have never called or insinuated anyone is a racist , I was actually called a racist last week. If rolling your eyes to online racism to black players isn't being comfortable with racism I apologise. I just try and understand what people think and give my opinion. I am never abusive.

As for Potty joining in to try and cancel free speech the guy is beyond parody. He abused me on multiple occasions calling me a pr*ck and worse. I have never called him anything.

He also said that he didn't think the n word was offensive.

Now I welcome all free speech within the law and site rules, I wouldn't block anyone as that goes against what I believe in. Potty is quite within his rights to block me but I would ask the mods to have a word re him asking others to block me, I don't think that's within the spirit of PASOTI.
Mod hat on. You state that you don’t know people on here and that you don’t know anything about them, so you cannot know if they are racist or not. That is a fair point, but you then use phrases such as ‘people like you’ when referring to racists and therefore insinuating that the person is racist. Mod hat back off again.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Nope, when I said "but its only been linked to the political movement by people like you" I was pointing out that you linked taking the knee with the Marxist movement, that doesn't in any way infer you are racist, it just means I think you are wrong to link the 2 when the players have said it isn't.
 
May 16, 2016
3,752
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It's his modus operandi. He has insinuated on a number of occasions that different posters are racist, myself included.

As a constant offender in this way, I'm surprised that the MODs let him get away with it especially when you consider people get pulled up/temporarily banned for far less.

He is, imo, an abhorrent person that truly believes he is a decent upstanding individual. The man is delusional beyond any comphrehension.
If you think of this thread for example, as a game of keepy uppy and that some posters are long term subtle wind up merchants that enjoy their perceived forum fame, you'll see the place differently. Some genuinely believe they are right but only because they see the world from within their limited outlook and inability to accept another contrasting view.

15 minutes and all that.
 

GreenThing

Administrator
Staff member
Lowey Sponsor
NHS Volunteer Supporter
Pasoti Donor
Sep 13, 2003
3,865
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Plymouth
Regardless of context, if you don’t know anything about someone then you shouldn’t be using the phrase ‘people like you’.
 

IJN

Site Owner
Nov 29, 2012
1,326
1,280
Modding of this forum is fraught with problems.

I hardly ever read it but when I do, I usually see people having a right pop.

You certainly need to be careful when brandying 'People like you' MKF as it stinks of generalisation.

Just calm it down if you will people, this forum allows much more latitude than the football forums as we understand that people that dwell down here are rather opinionated hence the forum's name.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Fair enough Ian , although I've been called a pr*ck and a racist and had someone call for everyone to block me although I have never abused anyone. Don't think that's on.
 
Mar 7, 2010
5,725
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Manchester
I'm not sure where people are getting their info that racism in UK football is a totally negligible problem as seems to be the suggestion from some (although I could be misreading?).
I've just caught the BBC news report which stated police have identified 207 possible criminal offenses in the wake of the euro final (1 is too many), whilst the PFA have identified a 48% rise in online abuse.
 
Aug 15, 2015
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Shoenice, I understand your viewpoint on the BLM stuff although don’t agree it relates to players in the UK anymore. If they decided to do a different gesture without a ‘political history’ for example the mobot (only thing I could think of) would you boo them still? Just interested if it is the gesture itself or that you don’t think they should do anything?

No I wouldn't be against or boo it. No problems with it. Whether this country has such deep seated racial problems however, I question. As I think I've said before in this thread, there's no doubt lots of racist individuals out there but whether this is such a deep seated institutional problem, I personally don't think so.

But I'd have no problems with a newly created gesture, something recognised globally which takes a stance against racism. But one that has no link to BLM or any similar types of organisations/movements.
 
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Aug 15, 2015
773
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I'm not sure where people are getting their info that racism in UK football is a totally negligible problem as seems to be the suggestion from some (although I could be misreading?).
I've just caught the BBC news report which stated police have identified 207 possible criminal offenses in the wake of the euro final (1 is too many), whilst the PFA have identified a 48% rise in online abuse.
For me it's the way that the George Floyd situation has manifested itself in the UK. Suddenly, racism in the UK is an enormous problem. Suddenly, there's only one pandemic, and it's not COVID, it's racism.

1 is indeed too many, but if you listen to BLM and others, you would think that England was racist from top to bottom. That institutionally, racism exists and stops black people from reaching the top. I just don't agree with any of it. I don't see how the UK is stopping black people from succeeding. I was reading up on how black people in China are treated recently and it's horrendous - https://www.hrw.org/news/2020/05/05/china-covid-19-discrimination-against-africans.

Do we really treat black people the same way in this country? I see black people succeeding everywhere. They are in city jobs, they are in politics, they are in top universities (ethnic minorities now account for 29% of new undergrads at Cambridge - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-57156553). I see black people welcomed into society, in restaurants, at bars, wherever.

I just think we're blowing 'racism' out of proportion in my view. Genuine racism. That's my issue and that's why I won't support BLM. They have an agenda that just isn't in line with UK society in my opinion.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Which would be relevant if anyone is asking you to support BLM - no one is. Just don't abuse footballers who are fighting racism.

So racism is blown out of proportion:

There are no Black chairmen, chief executive officers or chief financial officers in any of Britain’s 100 largest companies.

Employment​

  • unemployment rates were significantly higher for ethnic minorities at 12.9 per cent compared with 6.3 per cent for White people
  • Black workers with degrees earn 23.1 per cent less on average than White workers
  • in Britain, significantly lower percentages of ethnic minorities (8.8 per cent) worked as managers, directors and senior officials, compared with White people (10.7 per cent) and this was particularly true for African or Caribbean or Black people (5.7 per cent) and those of mixed ethnicity (7.2 per cent)
  • Black people who leave school with A-levels typically get paid 14.3 per cent less than their White peers

Education​

  • just 6 per cent of Black school leavers attended a Russell Group university, compared with 12 per cent of mixed and Asian school leavers and 11 per cent of White school leavers
  • Black Caribbean and Mixed White/Black Caribbean children have rates of permanent exclusion about three times that of the pupil population as a whole

Crime​

  • rates of prosecution and sentencing for Black people were three times higher than for White people,18 per thousand population compared with six per thousand population for White people
  • for sentencing it was 13 per thousand population for Black people and five per thousand population for White people
  • in England and Wales ethnic minority children and adults are more likely to be a victim of homicide
  • the homicide rate for Black people was 30.5 per million population, 14.1 for Asian people and 8.9 for White people
  • White women are more at risk of domestic abuse than ethnic minority women, with 7.4 per cent reported being victims of abuse compared with 4.4 per cent of ethnic minority women
  • race hate crimes on Britain’s railway networks have risen by 37 per cent
  • in England, 37.4 per cent of Black people and 44.8 per cent of Asian people felt unsafe being at home or around their local area, compared with 29.2 per cent of White people

Living standards​

  • Pakistani or Bangladeshi and Black adults are more likely to live in substandard accommodation than White people
  • 30.9 per cent of Pakistani or Bangladeshi people live in overcrowded accommodation, while for Black people the figure is 26.8 per cent and for White people it is 8.3 per cent
  • if you are an ethnic minority person, you are still more likely to live in poverty. Our evidence shows that 35.7 per cent of ethnic minorities were more likely to live in poverty compared with 17.2 per cent of White people
  • in Scotland, ethnic minority households are more likely to experience overcrowding, with 11.8 per cent for ethnic minority households compared with 2.9 per cent for White households
 
Sep 8, 2011
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Glenholt
But literally no one is asking you to support BLM. EFL and the club are asking you to respect the choice of players to make a 10 second gesture prior to matches.

Can you just respect that? For the sake of our players who choose to do it?

EDITED: for grammar.
 
Aug 15, 2015
773
67
But literally no one is asking you to support BLM. EFL and the club are asking you to respect the choice of players to make a 10 second gesture prior to matches.

Can you just respect that? For the sake of our players who choose to do it?

EDITED: for grammar.
What if I ask you to respect a Nazi salute because to me it means love and peace? Would you support that because I have asked you to respect it? I think the BLM is totally wrong, and I won't support it.
 
Nov 15, 2011
1,736
143
Why do you keep saying you won't support something no one is asking you to support?

And why would you compare an anti racist gesture to a Nazi salute. It's just weird.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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For me it's the way that the George Floyd situation has manifested itself in the UK. Suddenly, racism in the UK is an enormous problem. Suddenly, there's only one pandemic, and it's not COVID, it's racism.

1 is indeed too many, but if you listen to BLM and others, you would think that England was racist from top to bottom. That institutionally, racism exists and stops black people from reaching the top. I just don't agree with any of it. I don't see how the UK is stopping black people from succeeding. I was reading up on how black people in China are treated recently and it's horrendous - https://www.hrw.org/news/2020/05/05/china-covid-19-discrimination-against-africans.

Do we really treat black people the same way in this country? I see black people succeeding everywhere. They are in city jobs, they are in politics, they are in top universities (ethnic minorities now account for 29% of new undergrads at Cambridge - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-57156553). I see black people welcomed into society, in restaurants, at bars, wherever.

I just think we're blowing 'racism' out of proportion in my view. Genuine racism. That's my issue and that's why I won't support BLM. They have an agenda that just isn't in line with UK society in my opinion.
I'm with you on this. The UK has worked considerably harder than a lot of Countries to guard against institutionalised racism. All you need to do is work in a police force or the Army, Navy, Air Force as a few examples, to see that racism is not tolerated in those institutions. There are most definitely racists in all those organisations but to say the institution itself is racist is just not right.

In fact, I'm sure there was a recent independent study carried out which pretty much agreed that institutional racism did not exist in the UK and yet some people with a different agenda still chose to dismiss it. MKF was more than likely one of those people.
 
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