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BLM, Taking a knee and THAT symbol of racism

Nov 15, 2011
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Zaha doesn’t boo people taking the knee and makes his own stand against racism in his own way I expect Rio is quite proud of him.
 
Apr 15, 2004
2,848
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East Devon
themightykeithfear":3eipe7e5 said:
Zaha doesn’t boo people taking the knee and makes his own stand against racism in his own way I expect Rio is quite proud of him.
Exactly. I specifically mentioned Zaha many posts ago - but Potty doesn't read or think about what anyone writes other than to mock & throw silly insults.

Zaha thinks taking a knee is inappropriate as he feels it looks subservient. It's a view, like other views that can be rationally argued. But he respectfully and quietly stands whilst others use the gesture because he respects the message even if he disagrees with the method of conveying it.

The boorish and overtly confrontational jeering can only be interpreted as being against the message itself. As the players, manager, FA etc have said repeatedly that message is simply anti-racist....then jeering it can only be seen as a racist act. How can it not be? Look - if I were to publicly boo and jeer anti-vaxxers then what can you deduce about my attitude to vaccinations? If you're against anti-racism then what are you for? It is a racist act .....but does that mean everyone who did boo is a full-on racist? Well, not necessarily because there will be some dim wits who might not have thought about it, might enjoy the attention, might just be following their mates, might have swallowed all sorts of crap on their social media and convinced it's all a creeping marxist black-power plot etc. Maybe if you sat them down and spoke to them they'd get it and be OK....maybe.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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Ave_IT":ed6cvedq said:
themightykeithfear":ed6cvedq said:
Zaha doesn’t boo people taking the knee and makes his own stand against racism in his own way I expect Rio is quite proud of him.
Exactly. I specifically mentioned Zaha many posts ago - but Potty doesn't read or think about what anyone writes other than to mock & throw silly insults.

Zaha thinks taking a knee is inappropriate as he feels it looks subservient. It's a view, like other views that can be rationally argued. But he respectfully and quietly stands whilst others use the gesture because he respects the message even if he disagrees with the method of conveying it.

The boorish and overtly confrontational jeering can only be interpreted as being against the message itself. As the players, manager, FA etc have said repeatedly that message is simply anti-racist....then jeering it can only be seen as a racist act. How can it not be? Look - if I were to publicly boo and jeer anti-vaxxers then what can you deduce about my attitude to vaccinations? If you're against anti-racism then what are you for? It is a racist act .....but does that mean everyone who did boo is a full-on racist? Well, not necessarily because there will be some dim wits who might not have thought about it, might enjoy the attention, might just be following their mates, might have swallowed all sorts of crap on their social media and convinced it's all a creeping marxist black-power plot etc. Maybe if you sat them down and spoke to them they'd get it and be OK....maybe.

So Zaha thinks taking the knee is inappropriate and you seem happy with that. So breaking it down a bit further, I guess its fair to say that he doesn't agree with the gesture? Is that fair comment Ave_IT?

You can use whatever words you want but the reality is, Zaha is not kneeling. He obviously disagrees with the action as do the people that are booing only he is displaying his thoughts on the gesture in a different way. He is no doubt standing there 'respectfully' because he is in a very difficult position, that being, he is black. Imagine the furore from the black community if he did boo. He obviously cannot do that so he is doing the one thing he feels he can do and that is tell everyone his reasons for not kneeling and then stand quietly. I think the saying is, he's stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Whichever way you look at it, he disagrees with the gesture. He's said that himself and you make a huge assumption when you say, 'he respects the message'. Having said that, it is a fair assumption to make about the message, however, I suggest his words and his actions say something different about the gesture. Just because you don't make a noise, it doesn't mean that you're not happy with something. You seem to be one of those people (of which there seems to be many especially on this forum) who listen but don't actually hear and only see what they want to see.

Well done though on moving away from calling the people that boo racists. I agree that to some it can be viewed as a racist act but the ignorant people calling the people that boo racist is not correct imo. :clap:
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Potty's mental contortions to try and equate Zaha with the people booing is insane, only someone like him could try and do that.

The facts are clear and now unarguable. Zaha respects people taking the knee. The booers know why the players are taking the knee and if they continue to boo it, they are either racist or ignorant. Or both.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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Talking about BLM itself, does anyone know if they actually have any policies or any sort of strategic direction that states what they would put in place to meet their demands? Especially their demand to defund the police? What do they actually mean by that? Are they saying get rid of the police force? If so, what are they proposing goes in their place? I've tried to find some info but have drawn a blank.

Any guidance would be appreciated, except from TMKF though as I can't see his posts. One of the best calls I've made incidentally, I recommend it :thumbup:
 
Jul 15, 2006
3,847
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Kenton, Devon
Pottypilgrim":3tg81j9m said:
Talking about BLM itself, does anyone know if they actually have any policies or any sort of strategic direction that states what they would put in place to meet their demands?:

As I understand it there was a call in America to reduce the budgets of certain police forces in the US - such as the NYPD - and reinvest that money in social programs in more deprived areas: employment, public health, education, improved facilities, etc. The argument being that if you help lift certain groups (and, let's face it, we're talking about predominantly black neighbourhoods here) out of poverty then you can break the poverty-crime link. And there is some justification in calls like this: the NYPD has a budget so big that, in terms of military spending across the world, it is ranked no36 - on a par with North Korea: you take all their uniformed officers into account, it is the 65th largest "armed force" in the world. It's that big. So, basically, I think the call is to stop militarizing police forces like the NYPD and to reinvest some of that money.

What doesn't make sense is when certain groups hijack this call and start saying stupid comments like "defunding the BBC". Whatever that means.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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141
Pottypilgrim":8lb3olkt said:
Talking about BLM itself, does anyone know if they actually have any policies or any sort of strategic direction that states what they would put in place to meet their demands? Especially their demand to defund the police? What do they actually mean by that? Are they saying get rid of the police force? If so, what are they proposing goes in their place? I've tried to find some info but have drawn a blank.

Any guidance would be appreciated, except from TMKF though as I can't see his posts. One of the best calls I've made incidentally, I recommend it :thumbup:

Except for Potty does see my posts he just pretends he's cancelled me but he hasn't really. Now he's calling for more woke cancelling! Didn't he start a post on freedom of speech?

The UK BLM statement clearly states their non political goals, they are a basic non political anti racist movement.

As for defunding the police, this isn't asking for there to be no police, in America the police are funded in different ways including privately which doesn't achieve the best results. The idea is that crime can be better reduced by reallocating funds to eg education social housing youth clubs etc
 
Sep 2, 2008
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Quinny":2hrw5q3h said:
Pottypilgrim":2hrw5q3h said:
Talking about BLM itself, does anyone know if they actually have any policies or any sort of strategic direction that states what they would put in place to meet their demands?:

As I understand it there was a call in America to reduce the budgets of certain police forces in the US - such as the NYPD - and reinvest that money in social programs in more deprived areas: employment, public health, education, improved facilities, etc. The argument being that if you help lift certain groups (and, let's face it, we're talking about predominantly black neighbourhoods here) out of poverty then you can break the poverty-crime link. And there is some justification in calls like this: the NYPD has a budget so big that, in terms of military spending across the world, it is ranked no36 - on a par with North Korea: you take all their uniformed officers into account, it is the 65th largest "armed force" in the world. It's that big. So, basically, I think the call is to stop militarizing police forces like the NYPD and to reinvest some of that money.

What doesn't make sense is when certain groups hijack this call and start saying stupid comments like "defunding the BBC". Whatever that means.

Cheers for that Quinny.

If what you say is correct then tbf, I can't argue with that. I was thinking that they were talking about binning the police completely.

The bit about 'stop militarising the police force' is a tricky one though. Police forces have to adapt to the threat and unfortunately in America, the threat is from guns. I really don't think that they can adopt a policing policy similar to ours.

Anyway, I don't want to go off topic too much. Thanks again.
 
Jul 15, 2006
3,847
38
Kenton, Devon
Pottypilgrim":3g7fbeav said:
Cheers for that Quinny.

If what you say is correct then tbf, I can't argue with that. I was thinking that they were talking about binning the police completely.

The bit about 'stop militarising the police force' is a tricky one though. Police forces have to adapt to the threat and unfortunately in America, the threat is from guns. I really don't think that they can adopt a policing policy similar to ours.

Anyway, I don't want to go off topic too much. Thanks again.

I just need to comment on the demilitarize bit before we close this little side-track. The main issue here is the opening of a US Defense Department program (1033) which allowed police departments to purchase surplus military-grade weaponry such as armoured carriers and grenade launchers. It was allowed under the Clinton administration with the intention of giving the various PDs more power in the war on drugs (mainly at those gangs at the top of the tree). However, once the police had access to this equipment they felt the need to use them for other purposes and, if anything would make difficult situations worse, such as what played out in Ferguson, Missouri.
 
May 16, 2016
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themightykeithfear":1lqheiv2 said:
He did, although Cole said he didn't complain about it , Ferdinand remained a good friend and the term was a light hearted slang term used by them meaning "fake".

Racism is all about the intent in your language, why you are saying what you are saying and whether you intend to hurt someone with it. People I think generally know if they are being racist and if they are trying to hurt someone. This wasn't the case here according to both parties.

So would that light hearted approach apply if John Terry said it in jest as a slang term, would you have treated him equally?
 
Nov 15, 2011
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Yes if he said it to a friend and what he said did not offend that person. It's not difficult to tell when people are or aren't being intentionally racist.
 
Sep 2, 2008
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ninjamissile":rcejhe1w said:
The delightful and loveable Sasha Johnson, the BLM leader/activist who was recently accidentally shot in the head by a black gang. She's on record as wanting the police defunded so I assume she and her family weren't keen on their involvement investigating the crime.

Anyway here she is speaking in a very special way. Does anyone here ever talk like this? Rhetorical question btw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEA6Q0h_Zak

Doesn't seem to a very pleasant individual at all, offering someone violence because they were asking perfectly valid questions. Looks like violence has come back and bit her on the ass. Karma is a bitch.

Also, to be in the close vicinity of someone that was the subject of a targeted shooting goes to show the sort of circles she moves in.

If you live by the sword...
 

GreenThing

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Sep 13, 2003
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Pottypilgrim":peubghcr said:
ninjamissile":peubghcr said:
The delightful and loveable Sasha Johnson, the BLM leader/activist who was recently accidentally shot in the head by a black gang. She's on record as wanting the police defunded so I assume she and her family weren't keen on their involvement investigating the crime.

Anyway here she is speaking in a very special way. Does anyone here ever talk like this? Rhetorical question btw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEA6Q0h_Zak

Doesn't seem to a very pleasant individual at all, offering someone violence because they were asking perfectly valid questions. Looks like violence has come back and bit her on the ass. Karma is a bitch.

Also, to be in the close vicinity of someone that was the subject of a targeted shooting goes to show the sort of circles she moves in.

If you live by the sword...

Can you imagine the outcry if she was shot by a white man?
 
Nov 15, 2011
1,727
141
GreenThing":2a9jbxgm said:
Pottypilgrim":2a9jbxgm said:
ninjamissile":2a9jbxgm said:
The delightful and loveable Sasha Johnson, the BLM leader/activist who was recently accidentally shot in the head by a black gang. She's on record as wanting the police defunded so I assume she and her family weren't keen on their involvement investigating the crime.

Anyway here she is speaking in a very special way. Does anyone here ever talk like this? Rhetorical question btw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEA6Q0h_Zak

Doesn't seem to a very pleasant individual at all, offering someone violence because they were asking perfectly valid questions. Looks like violence has come back and bit her on the ass. Karma is a bitch.

Also, to be in the close vicinity of someone that was the subject of a targeted shooting goes to show the sort of circles she moves in.

If you live by the sword...

Can you imagine the outcry if she was shot by a white man?

Now I’m no expert in Buddhism but I’m pretty sure Karma doesn’t mean a black woman being shot in the head because she’s not a very pleasant individual.

As regards an outcry if she was shot by a white man it would depend on the circumstances. There was an outcry when George Floyd was murdered by a white policeman in broad daylight by slowly squeezing the life out of him over 9 minutes, and if that had happened to her then you’re right there would have been an outcry.

Back on topic Scotland aren’t going to take the knee and that is their absolute freedom to do so. However they do state their respect for those that do. Harry Kane has explained on the front of the Sun today why the players take the knee and asked people not to boo that. The real patriotic fans who respect our players won’t.
 

GreenThing

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Sep 13, 2003
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So is is ok for her to call someone a c@@n? Would it be different if someone was calling her a c@@n instead? If she represents the BLM movement, I’m not surprised that people are booing.