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Signed and sealed The Grandstand contract has been signed!!

Aug 5, 2015
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Clearly the millions of Janners who I’ve seen pass through the gates of Home Park over the last 50 years have always had it wrong. I think there is a Janner mentality at work here and in my view it is expressed by the constant stream of negativity and hostility that some people appear to revel in.

That we have not achieved more is nothing to do with the people. It’s to do with the fact that there is no real money in the Westcountry. Millionaires don’t grow on trees down here and multi millionaires with tens of millions to throw around simply do not exist. They never have and never will.
Unless of course a Russian moneylaunderer or a Thai crook takes an interest in us - heaven forbid.
 
T

The Grumpy Loyal

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Quizmike":3o8p9038 said:
Until a new investor turns up, which the new facilities will help, I don't see how supporting the current regime is settling for mediocrity.

Brent knows that he doesnt have the funds for the Championship and will have to stand aside sometime. The Halletts know this as well- don't forget their loan will build the new facilities and will increase the value of their shareholding in the end. But attacking the Chairman (as other do elsewhere) will not help the search for new money.

Fair points Mike. But there was a very telling phrase that Brent used many years ago that he in no way was looking for “walleted Directors” to join him in the Boardroom. Now this was prior to the HHP1 shambles all falling apart. It couldn’t have been made any clearer at the time ( and indeed started my alarm bells ringing) that Brent was wanting any development profits to be solely an Akkeron benefit. In layman’s terms, if there was booty to be made, he wanted it. He wanted to keep the overwhelming majority shareholding in the club.

Since then his personal situation has changed. His hotel portfolio has been largely reduced. He’s had the Oldway Mansion fiasco. The Civic Centre redevelopment which was handed to him on a silver platter by the Council, he’s had to hand back because he simply couldn’t do it. In short, he’s a poor poor developer. Which is why the only reason the refurb is happening is because his hand has been forced to dilute his shareholding and bring the Halletts onboard - a very welcome addition in my book.

But as far as any ‘search for new money’ goes, as you put it, there has to be the WILL to search for it. Until that happens then Brent still clings to his marginal majority shareholding, and the club bumbles along with our financial realities masked hugely by the great job being done by Derek Adams.
 

Biggs

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Grumpy, the flip side to that lack of investment argument is that JB has ALWAYS said that the best and most sustainable way forward for PAFC is to make its own money and not rely on a sugar daddy.

I don’t know how you can say that’s not working, given the progress on and off the pitch. And it’s going to get better with the new grandstand facilities providing extra revenue streams.

As for Derek Adams ‘masking’ the financial realities... he was hired and kept on because his philosophies match the club’s. And he has signed a long term contract for the same reason. It’s not an accident.
 
Oct 24, 2010
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The Grumpy Loyal":3hrfv1fb said:
Quizmike":3hrfv1fb said:
Until a new investor turns up, which the new facilities will help, I don't see how supporting the current regime is settling for mediocrity.

Brent knows that he doesnt have the funds for the Championship and will have to stand aside sometime. The Halletts know this as well- don't forget their loan will build the new facilities and will increase the value of their shareholding in the end. But attacking the Chairman (as other do elsewhere) will not help the search for new money.

Fair points Mike. But there was a very telling phrase that Brent used many years ago that he in no way was looking for “walleted Directors” to join him in the Boardroom. Now this was prior to the HHP1 shambles all falling apart. It couldn’t have been made any clearer at the time ( and indeed started my alarm bells ringing) that Brent was wanting any development profits to be solely an Akkeron benefit. In layman’s terms, if there was booty to be made, he wanted it. He wanted to keep the overwhelming majority shareholding in the club.

Since then his personal situation has changed. His hotel portfolio has been largely reduced. He’s had the Oldway Mansion fiasco. The Civic Centre redevelopment which was handed to him on a silver platter by the Council, he’s had to hand back because he simply couldn’t do it. In short, he’s a poor poor developer. Which is why the only reason the refurb is happening is because his hand has been forced to dilute his shareholding and bring the Halletts onboard - a very welcome addition in my book.

But as far as any ‘search for new money’ goes, as you put it, there has to be the WILL to search for it. Until that happens then Brent still clings to his marginal majority shareholding, and the club bumbles along with our financial realities masked hugely by the great job being done by Derek Adams.
You do have an incredibly negative take on Mr Brent’s tenure. He has made it clear from the off that his financial input would be limited and the club would become self-sustaining and at the right time when the right person, or persons ,come along with the financial clout to take the club forward then he would step down. He has always made that clear. I don’t understand why you would have a problem with that.
Also this has been done to death on here so it’s amazing that you don’t understand the concept that the development profits which Akkeron hope to make from HHP is effectively funding for the rescue package when Mr Brent saved the club from liquidation. It is a shame that those profits are lost to the club but don’t blame Mr Brent, the fault lies with the previous board of Mr Stapleton and his friends.
 
Feb 8, 2005
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esmer":31obf61b said:
The Grumpy Loyal":31obf61b said:
Quizmike":31obf61b said:
Until a new investor turns up, which the new facilities will help, I don't see how supporting the current regime is settling for mediocrity.

Brent knows that he doesnt have the funds for the Championship and will have to stand aside sometime. The Halletts know this as well- don't forget their loan will build the new facilities and will increase the value of their shareholding in the end. But attacking the Chairman (as other do elsewhere) will not help the search for new money.

Fair points Mike. But there was a very telling phrase that Brent used many years ago that he in no way was looking for “walleted Directors” to join him in the Boardroom. Now this was prior to the HHP1 shambles all falling apart. It couldn’t have been made any clearer at the time ( and indeed started my alarm bells ringing) that Brent was wanting any development profits to be solely an Akkeron benefit. In layman’s terms, if there was booty to be made, he wanted it. He wanted to keep the overwhelming majority shareholding in the club.

Since then his personal situation has changed. His hotel portfolio has been largely reduced. He’s had the Oldway Mansion fiasco. The Civic Centre redevelopment which was handed to him on a silver platter by the Council, he’s had to hand back because he simply couldn’t do it. In short, he’s a poor poor developer. Which is why the only reason the refurb is happening is because his hand has been forced to dilute his shareholding and bring the Halletts onboard - a very welcome addition in my book.

But as far as any ‘search for new money’ goes, as you put it, there has to be the WILL to search for it. Until that happens then Brent still clings to his marginal majority shareholding, and the club bumbles along with our financial realities masked hugely by the great job being done by Derek Adams.
You do have an incredibly negative take on Mr Brent’s tenure. He has made it clear from the off that his financial input would be limited and the club would become self-sustaining and at the right time when the right person, or persons ,come along with the financial clout to take the club forward then he would step down. He has always made that clear. I don’t understand why you would have a problem with that.
Also this has been done to death on here so it’s amazing that you don’t understand the concept that the development profits which Akkeron hope to make from HHP is effectively funding for the rescue package when Mr Brent saved the club from liquidation. It is a shame that those profits are lost to the club but don’t blame Mr Brent, the fault lies with the previous board of Mr Stapleton and his friends.

You are right, Es, it was the previous board, but Stapleton was forced to stand down from his position, and it was Keith Todd and Sir Roy Gardener and Kagami were the instigators of the downfall by taking their eyes off the ball and with their speculation of the England World Cup bid.

Brent has said that the football club should be able to return to the Championship organically, but that he would be unable to take them further without extra outside investment, and that he would step down if a suitable person was found to be able to do so.

That doesn't mean that he WILL step down as soon as we get to the championship, it means that he would be willing to step down, if a suitable candidate would be forthcoming, that could provide the means for the club to step up to the next level.

If the past has any bearing on the future, then he could be with us for a very long time!!
 

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jimsing":2cdbbu6y said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.
 
Mar 21, 2013
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monkeywrench":3lc0zky0 said:
jimsing":3lc0zky0 said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.

He’s like the kid who gets the brand new games console for Christmas that none of his friends have got yet but moans that he didn’t get a brand new TV to go with it. It’s not ambition he has its ungratefulness & the want for more, bigger, now without the means to pay for it.
 
Nov 3, 2006
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esmer":1c1al84i said:
The Grumpy Loyal":1c1al84i said:
Quizmike":1c1al84i said:
Until a new investor turns up, which the new facilities will help, I don't see how supporting the current regime is settling for mediocrity.

Brent knows that he doesnt have the funds for the Championship and will have to stand aside sometime. The Halletts know this as well- don't forget their loan will build the new facilities and will increase the value of their shareholding in the end. But attacking the Chairman (as other do elsewhere) will not help the search for new money.

Fair points Mike. But there was a very telling phrase that Brent used many years ago that he in no way was looking for “walleted Directors” to join him in the Boardroom. Now this was prior to the HHP1 shambles all falling apart. It couldn’t have been made any clearer at the time ( and indeed started my alarm bells ringing) that Brent was wanting any development profits to be solely an Akkeron benefit. In layman’s terms, if there was booty to be made, he wanted it. He wanted to keep the overwhelming majority shareholding in the club.

Since then his personal situation has changed. His hotel portfolio has been largely reduced. He’s had the Oldway Mansion fiasco. The Civic Centre redevelopment which was handed to him on a silver platter by the Council, he’s had to hand back because he simply couldn’t do it. In short, he’s a poor poor developer. Which is why the only reason the refurb is happening is because his hand has been forced to dilute his shareholding and bring the Halletts onboard - a very welcome addition in my book.

But as far as any ‘search for new money’ goes, as you put it, there has to be the WILL to search for it. Until that happens then Brent still clings to his marginal majority shareholding, and the club bumbles along with our financial realities masked hugely by the great job being done by Derek Adams.
You do have an incredibly negative take on Mr Brent’s tenure. He has made it clear from the off that his financial input would be limited and the club would become self-sustaining and at the right time when the right person, or persons ,come along with the financial clout to take the club forward then he would step down. He has always made that clear. I don’t understand why you would have a problem with that.
Also this has been done to death on here so it’s amazing that you don’t understand the concept that the development profits which Akkeron hope to make from HHP is effectively funding for the rescue package when Mr Brent saved the club from liquidation. It is a shame that those profits are lost to the club but don’t blame Mr Brent, the fault lies with the previous board of Mr Stapleton and his friends.

Some people have a take on a situation, and no matter how clearly the facts are staring them in the face, they can't bring themselves to admit they're wrong.
 
T

The Grumpy Loyal

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monkeywrench":fpcuollr said:
jimsing":fpcuollr said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.

And here's another one that gets the bunting out.

Apparently, for Monkey, it beggars belief that Argyle competing in Division 3 isn't humdrum mediocrity.

Are we living the dream here, or am I living in some sort of parallel universe?

It beggars belief how low some peoples aspirations lay. Again, the Janner mentality lives strong!
 
So you think we should just be elected to the Championship because that's where we were when all this crap started?

Get a grip mate - we are competing with other clubs with similar aspirations here - we have no automatic right to promotion, and we are getting better year on year for the past 7 years.

Perhaps you could provide us with some solutions as to where we are going wrong?
 

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The Grumpy Loyal":3b6xkg7e said:
monkeywrench":3b6xkg7e said:
jimsing":3b6xkg7e said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.

And here's another one that gets the bunting out.

Apparently, for Monkey, it beggars belief that Argyle competing in Division 3 isn't humdrum mediocrity.

Are we living the dream here, or am I living in some sort of parallel universe?

It beggars belief how low some peoples aspirations lay. Again, the Janner mentality lives strong!

Grumps, I think you have it wrong.

It is not how low some peoples expectations are but how high others are and the timescales required.

e.g. myself.

Am I happy with where we at this time? No.
Could we have done better last season? Probably.
Are we going to collapse into administration? Not under this chairmans watch.
Are we spending more than we get in? Yes. But only because there has been external money put into the club for infrastructure (and specifically for that infrastructure).
Can we buy players costing 100's of thousands.? No.
Can we buy players costing 10's of thousands? Only if deemed good enough.
Can we get out of this league, upwardly? If the green god smiles and Adams keeps producing over achieving teams.

Would I be happy if we could retain our place in the current league? Yes.
Would I be happy if we could have a go at getting promoted? Absolutely, Yes.

Would I be happy if the club went bust trying to get promotion this year? No. Emphatically, No.
Would I be happy if the club tried to bust the bank to get to the dream land? No, Emphatically, No.

Where would you say your timescales and costs would be?

Remember. If you break the bank you have no club.

You may not like it but be reminded of the last time the club "pushed the boat out". £17M debt and down to a few minutes of going out of existence.
 
T

The Grumpy Loyal

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Heathrow Green":3co3k7mb said:
The Grumpy Loyal":3co3k7mb said:
monkeywrench":3co3k7mb said:
jimsing":3co3k7mb said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.

And here's another one that gets the bunting out.

Apparently, for Monkey, it beggars belief that Argyle competing in Division 3 isn't humdrum mediocrity.

Are we living the dream here, or am I living in some sort of parallel universe?

It beggars belief how low some peoples aspirations lay. Again, the Janner mentality lives strong!

Grumps, I think you have it wrong.
Where would you say your timescales and costs would be?
You may not like it but be reminded of the last time the club "pushed the boat out". £17M debt and down to a few minutes of going out of existence.

Just to touch on a couple relevant points you make.

In terms of timescale, going into the 8th season of Brents tenure, and achievements amounting to a promotion from tier 4 to tier 3. I accept that for some people, this is some sort of bizarre Nirvana. But I struggle to get too excited by that. Again though that's just a personal opinion.

As far as pushing the boat out goes, if you are going to try and make an argument for Argyle never attempting to do anything ambitious, because of the atrocious decision making of a few directors a few years ago, then i'm afraid you are one of the many small-time thinking mentality types that pervades PAFC.

Brent by his own admission doesn't have the financial clout to even let us compete with the top 8 in this league, financially. I don't blame him for that. He isn't a football man. I wouldn't expect him to throw his own personal wealth at Argyle. What grips my poo is he is hanging on to a controlling interest in the club, rather than doing what is ultimately best for PAFC and looking for people who genuinely COULD invest meaningfully, to take the club further.
 
Feb 8, 2005
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The Grumpy Loyal":3976uskm said:
Heathrow Green":3976uskm said:
The Grumpy Loyal":3976uskm said:
monkeywrench":3976uskm said:
jimsing":3976uskm said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.

And here's another one that gets the bunting out.

Apparently, for Monkey, it beggars belief that Argyle competing in Division 3 isn't humdrum mediocrity.

Are we living the dream here, or am I living in some sort of parallel universe?

It beggars belief how low some peoples aspirations lay. Again, the Janner mentality lives strong!

Grumps, I think you have it wrong.
Where would you say your timescales and costs would be?
You may not like it but be reminded of the last time the club "pushed the boat out". £17M debt and down to a few minutes of going out of existence.

Just to touch on a couple relevant points you make.

In terms of timescale, going into the 8th season of Brents tenure, and achievements amounting to a promotion from tier 4 to tier 3. I accept that for some people, this is some sort of bizarre Nirvana. But I struggle to get too excited by that. Again though that's just a personal opinion.

As far as pushing the boat out goes, if you are going to try and make an argument for Argyle never attempting to do anything ambitious, because of the atrocious decision making of a few directors a few years ago, then i'm afraid you are one of the many small-time thinking mentality types that pervades PAFC.

Brent by his own admission doesn't have the financial clout to even let us compete with the top 8 in this league, financially. I don't blame him for that. He isn't a football man. I wouldn't expect him to throw his own personal wealth at Argyle. What grips my poo is he is hanging on to a controlling interest in the club, rather than doing what is ultimately best for PAFC and looking for people who genuinely COULD invest meaningfully, to take the club further.


How do you know he isn't looking for someone, Grumps. He allowed Hallett into the boardroom, didn't he? Who else should he have allowed in? Is there anyone else?

They would have to have the interests of the Club at heart, not someone who would invest for his own personal gain, of course. Cuts it down a bit, doesn't it?

Perhaps you could have a go at persuading Chris Dawson to join us.....oh hang on a minute, he isn't interested in football is he? What about Deborah Meadon, Grumps..............no there's that football in the way again.

Maybe we could find someone who says they are lifetime supporters, but really only want to join for what they could get out of it.............hang on, Keith Todd tried that and that didn't work out.

Er, how about an ex Chairman from a big club like Manchester United, a "Sir" even, he'd do it wouldn't he?.........oh hang on we had Sir Roy Gardner as Chairman didn't we, that didn't work out too well either.

It's not as easy as you think, is it, but if you could come up with someone who fits the bill, Grumps, I'm sure James Brent's door will always be open for your suggestions.

He might even be glad to get out and build his own empire instead of paying so much attention towards an unambitious football club such as ours!!!!!
 
Jan 17, 2017
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jimsing":k8t0o7w2 said:
The Grumpy Loyal":k8t0o7w2 said:
Heathrow Green":k8t0o7w2 said:
The Grumpy Loyal":k8t0o7w2 said:
monkeywrench":k8t0o7w2 said:
jimsing":k8t0o7w2 said:
Wow, Grumps, you think Brent's time at PAFC is "humdrum mediocrity"?

It's worse than I thought, Sister, get him into the operating theatre immediately!!!

It beggars belief doesn't it.

And here's another one that gets the bunting out.

Apparently, for Monkey, it beggars belief that Argyle competing in Division 3 isn't humdrum mediocrity.

Are we living the dream here, or am I living in some sort of parallel universe?

It beggars belief how low some peoples aspirations lay. Again, the Janner mentality lives strong!

Grumps, I think you have it wrong.
Where would you say your timescales and costs would be?
You may not like it but be reminded of the last time the club "pushed the boat out". £17M debt and down to a few minutes of going out of existence.

Just to touch on a couple relevant points you make.

In terms of timescale, going into the 8th season of Brents tenure, and achievements amounting to a promotion from tier 4 to tier 3. I accept that for some people, this is some sort of bizarre Nirvana. But I struggle to get too excited by that. Again though that's just a personal opinion.

As far as pushing the boat out goes, if you are going to try and make an argument for Argyle never attempting to do anything ambitious, because of the atrocious decision making of a few directors a few years ago, then i'm afraid you are one of the many small-time thinking mentality types that pervades PAFC.

Brent by his own admission doesn't have the financial clout to even let us compete with the top 8 in this league, financially. I don't blame him for that. He isn't a football man. I wouldn't expect him to throw his own personal wealth at Argyle. What grips my poo is he is hanging on to a controlling interest in the club, rather than doing what is ultimately best for PAFC and looking for people who genuinely COULD invest meaningfully, to take the club further.


How do you know he isn't looking for someone, Grumps. He allowed Hallett into the boardroom, didn't he? Who else should he have allowed in? Is there anyone else?

They would have to have the interests of the Club at heart, not someone who would invest for his own personal gain, of course. Cuts it down a bit, doesn't it?

Perhaps you could have a go at persuading Chris Dawson to join us.....oh hang on a minute, he isn't interested in football is he? What about Deborah Meadon, Grumps..............no there's that football in the way again.

Maybe we could find someone who says they are lifetime supporters, but really only want to join for what they could get out of it.............hang on, Keith Todd tried that and that didn't work out.

Er, how about an ex Chairman from a big club like Manchester United, a "Sir" even, he'd do it wouldn't he?.........oh hang on we had Sir Roy Gardner as Chairman didn't we, that didn't work out too well either.

It's not as easy as you think, is it, but if you could come up with someone who fits the bill, Grumps, I'm sure James Brent's door will always be open for your suggestions.

He might even be glad to get out and build his own empire instead of paying so much attention towards an unambitious football club such as ours!!!!!

This is what's boring with these Brent out-ers, they've got this idea that outside JB's office is a line of multi-billionaire investors wanting to buy the club and JB gives them all the middle finger.

If they genuinely want him out maybe they should be out looking for a new chairman who's willing to pump the millions in they want to take the club to where ever they feel it's entitled to be.

Just a boring argument on repeat otherwise. If you WANT something to happen then DO something about it, or stop going on and on and on as it's making you sound petty.
 
Aug 5, 2015
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736
So playing in Division 3 is humdrum mediocrity. Someone needs to look at our historic record on GOS for example. The truth is we’ve spent almost equal time in divs 2 and 3 with the occasional foray into div 4. I think it’s called managing your expectations. We’d all like better sure but let’s not pretend we’re or should be vastly superior to everyone else and are entitled to be in a better place.