Identity crisis? A team and club without an identity | PASOTI
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Identity crisis? A team and club without an identity

A

Alan Fortune

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As a life long Argyle fan living in London, now aged 70, I do not see Argyle as often these days as I once did. This season I have seen three away games, including Friday's game at Gillingham. I find Argyle something of a puzzle. Every time I see them they play a different way in terms of formation, tactics, playing stye etc. the only common thread is the lack of comfort on the ball of most defenders and midfield players, and their tendency to hoof when under even the slightest pressure.

There are no obvious pre-rehearsed patterns of play. No passing trainges and other moves that have been practised repeatedly on the training ground. No regular movement patterns off the ball so that the player in possession knows instinctively where his team mates are, and how to find them with a pass. This, to me, smacks of a lack of rigour in the coahing methods, and a lack of faith in a system of play that the team can fall back on when things are not going well. After 4 years in charge, I am still not quite sure what the 'Derek Adams way' is.

I have a season ticket at my local club, Brentford FC. They are, in my view, a model of how a small to medium-sized club should be run. Since Matthew Benham took over the club 8 years ago, there has been a 'Brentford way', which happens to be an attractive style of 'pass and move' football, and we season ticket holders know we are going to enjoy the home games whatever the result. There is a Brentford brand; something the club will stick with as managers and players come and go.

What is the PAFC brand? What is the Derek Adams style that can be retained and passed on when DA himself leaves? What is the playing 'philosophy' of PAFC? After 4 years, I still do not know. If you have a club style, then it makes it easier to scout players who will be able to play that way, even if it s lousy, scarcely watchable 'Pulis-ball' muscular . style of play. At least TP's teams have an identity.

I think PAFC needs to take a hard look at itself as a club from top to bottom. Everything on and off the pitch seems a bit haphazard to me. We should look at better run clubs who have forged an identity and learn from them.
 

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Mar 4, 2012
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A lot think about there.
 

davie nine

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Jan 23, 2015
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That is a very interesting and thought provoking post, Alan.

I thought that I knew our identity in the first 3 years of DA’s reign and, without being able to document it, I was quite comfortable with it. I think that our signings, this year in particular, have been generally disappointing and hence we have struggled to maintain our identity.
 
Apr 9, 2011
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Well said agree entirely. I think the vast majority of REALISTIC supporters would agree whole heartedly. Ship without a rudder springs to mind
 
Mar 8, 2016
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Yeah I get what the op is saying but as a club we have a small time mentality. The board are happy with us being small time, the club are happy with a manager that thinks short term not long term. Nothing will change, to be honest I can see us getting relegated when we play Scunthorpe and our fans clapping these muppets off the pitch. We will never fulfill our potential because the mentality of the whole set up is wrong, always has been always will be. Managing expectations is the key now for argyle fans.
 
Sep 16, 2009
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Good post and totally right about Brentford. My granddad was a lifelong Brentford fan so for his sake I hope they can be the next Bournemouth and reach the premier league.

Talking of which Bournemouth (my local club) is another model club, with the "Eddie Howe way"

Has the change in ownership affected Argyle's identity? All the flak I've seen this weekend is aimed at Derek Adams, but very little at a board who evidently aren't providing him with funds to buy a decent team. Surprising perhaps that the board seems to escape any flak this season.

I think its a mixture of poor leadership at the top and poor managerial recruitment/tactics on the pitch, plus, obviously poor player performances, because obviously the same team put together a decent run in January and February and into March...
 
Jan 4, 2005
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It is interesting reading but wanting to compare Bournemouth and Brentford with Argyle is like comparing a horse chestnut with a chestnut horse. Both those clubs in higher divisions have owners, who have pumped big monies into their clubs. They can acquire more accomplished players and Bournemouth in particular has a long serving manager/coach with a settled team who are capable of good ball retention and an established pattern of play,

The Directors of Argyle are lesser men in terms of wealth, I know. we now have a new Chairman, who to his immense credit is in the process of restoring our main grandstand with superb catering facilities with the objective of boosting operational turnover on non-match days. This is all yet to fully materialise but the focus is there to generate retained profits from that source for the club to perhaps afford more skilful players than are presently playing.

A lot of 'ifs' still remain, but at least Chairman Simon Hallett is trying hard to get the club moving on a sound footing without the wealth of TV income that both Brentford, and Bournemouth in particular wallow in, on an annual basis with little 'trickledown' effect to the 3rd tier of League soccer in England.
 
What a great OP. One of the best this season and absolutely spot-on. I agree that the common theme with our oponents, home or away, is that they all look as though they’ve played together for some while, have a pattern to their play, and nearly always seem more comfortable on the ball than us. Is it because their team changes are more gradualist, with fewer changes at the end of each season? Is it simply player quality? I can’t pretend to know the answer, but your analysis of the problem is dead right.
 
Jul 29, 2016
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mervyn":242cpcnt said:
What a great OP. One of the best this season and absolutely spot-on. I agree that the common theme with our oponents, home or away, is that they all look as though they’ve played together for some while, have a pattern to their play, and nearly always seem more comfortable on the ball than us. Is it because their team changes are more gradualist, with fewer changes at the end of each season? Is it simply player quality? I can’t pretend to know the answer, but your analysis of the problem is dead right.

I have never understood why the team is demolished at the end of each season. I can understand losing some due to contracts and better offers but what happens at PAFC is pathetic. Also Adams usually buys dross. (That'll be the budget then - b***poo). I don't think he has a clue what he wants or what he is doing. Stuck in a brain fart.
 
Aug 21, 2008
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Plymouth
Army green":37grzym8 said:
Yeah I get what the op is saying but as a club we have a small time mentality. The board are happy with us being small time, the club are happy with a manager that thinks short term not long term. Nothing will change, to be honest I can see us getting relegated when we play Scunthorpe and our fans clapping these muppets off the pitch. We will never fulfill our potential because the mentality of the whole set up is wrong, always has been always will be. Managing expectations is the key now for argyle fans.

I feel that the new chairman is more interested in the improved "prawn sandwich" facilities for the few rather than the football for the many.

The new facilities may produce more income long term but in the meantime funds are diverted away from the football.
 
Mar 23, 2008
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Fully agree on every point. We seem to be run on short term thinking and recycling average players with a boring and indefinable style of play. Brentford have it right, a clear progressive route forwards and they followed the Swansea model and improved it. Wouldn't it be great to see that sort of forward thinking mentality at HP.
 

Jimmyd

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Jan 3, 2009
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David_Fisher":2e3ywphp said:
Army green":2e3ywphp said:
Yeah I get what the op is saying but as a club we have a small time mentality. The board are happy with us being small time, the club are happy with a manager that thinks short term not long term. Nothing will change, to be honest I can see us getting relegated when we play Scunthorpe and our fans clapping these muppets off the pitch. We will never fulfill our potential because the mentality of the whole set up is wrong, always has been always will be. Managing expectations is the key now for argyle fans.

I feel that the new chairman is more interested in the improved "prawn sandwich" facilities for the few rather than the football for the many.

The new facilities may produce more income long term but in the meantime funds are diverted away from the football.

My brother met someone who i believe is related to Hallett a few months ago (possibly his brother in law). I understand getting the facilities right is a huge deal. It was menetioned that the average matchday spend per head at Exeter Chiefs is over £20 (not including tickets), while at Argyle is is around £2 (im paraphrasing but you get the idea, and i think tickets are cheaper there than at argyle). If we get the facilities to a point where a good proportion of fans want to stay behind after or turn up early for a couple beers then this will only help create funds to invest in the squad.
 
Sep 6, 2006
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Alan Fortune":2jnk1v9g said:
As a life long Argyle fan living in London, now aged 70, I do not see Argyle as often these days as I once did. This season I have seen three away games, including Friday's game at Gillingham. I find Argyle something of a puzzle. Every time I see them they play a different way in terms of formation, tactics, playing stye etc. the only common thread is the lack of comfort on the ball of most defenders and midfield players, and their tendency to hoof when under even the slightest pressure.

There are no obvious pre-rehearsed patterns of play. No passing trainges and other moves that have been practised repeatedly on the training ground. No regular movement patterns off the ball so that the player in possession knows instinctively where his team mates are, and how to find them with a pass. This, to me, smacks of a lack of rigour in the coahing methods, and a lack of faith in a system of play that the team can fall back on when things are not going well. After 4 years in charge, I am still not quite sure what the 'Derek Adams way' is.

I have a season ticket at my local club, Brentford FC. They are, in my view, a model of how a small to medium-sized club should be run. Since Matthew Benham took over the club 8 years ago, there has been a 'Brentford way', which happens to be an attractive style of 'pass and move' football, and we season ticket holders know we are going to enjoy the home games whatever the result. There is a Brentford brand; something the club will stick with as managers and players come and go.

What is the PAFC brand? What is the Derek Adams style that can be retained and passed on when DA himself leaves? What is the playing 'philosophy' of PAFC? After 4 years, I still do not know. If you have a club style, then it makes it easier to scout players who will be able to play that way, even if it s lousy, scarcely watchable 'Pulis-ball' muscular . style of play. At least TP's teams have an identity.

I think PAFC needs to take a hard look at itself as a club from top to bottom. Everything on and off the pitch seems a bit haphazard to me. We should look at better run clubs who have forged an identity and learn from them.

I dont think Adams has the ability to instill a style of football. He just relies on individual brilliance from Lameiras or in previous seasons Carey. Even 1st half at Gillingham we werent good. Very defensive. Midfield players would pick up the ball and have no outlet as everybody was behind the ball.